Video 8

8. Katha Upanishad | Mantras 1.1.21 - 24 | Swami Sarvapriyananda

[Music] may the lord protect us both the teacher and the taught together by revealing knowledge may the lord protect us both by giving us the results of knowledge may we attain illumination together let what we study be invigorating may we not care at each other om peace peace peace so in qatar panishad we were on the twentieth mantra where nachiketa finally asks the question which will begin the teaching of vedanta before this nuchiketa had been offered three boons by the lord of death yama and the first boon that the little boy asked for was that i should go back to the world of the living and my father should be happy with me basically settling his worldly affairs the second boon was he asked about the best vedic sacrifice which can guarantee a heaven one of those temporary heavens after death so basically taking care of his other worldly affairs now he is asking the ultimate question what is the reality about ourselves is there anything that lives after is there anything that continues after physical death or is there nothing are we just these bodies and there also he's not asking about the subtle body because remember he already believes that the body dies and then we go on to other lives but what's beyond all that what's the ultimate truth about ourselves that's the question he's actually asking because the question itself which he asked is is a little vague he said some say there is something after death others say there is nothing after this i would like to know the answer to this mystery you are the lord of death you are the best person to ask this so tell me is he asking about atma our real nature existence consciousness place or is he asking about something that survives death even the subtle body the mind survives it all according to the vedantic paradigm so he's asking about atma here that's the general understanding you can see that from the teaching which yama will give him after this he'll teach vedanta the nature of the our real nature not the body not the mind beyond the physical body beyond the subtle body beyond even the causal body who we really are all right but before that there will be a test to see the fitness for this knowledge yama the lord of death will hesitate to give him the knowledge not because he cannot teach it he has that knowledge he can transmit it but he wants to know whether the little boy is fit for this knowledge now what's the question about this fitness why can't we be given if the knowledge is there let's have that knowledge why bother so much about who is fit and not fit if not fit if one is not capable two things will happen one straightforward is that it will it'll have no effect it will uh we will not realize will not become enlightened that breakthrough the knowledge of brahman brahma ghyana liberation spiritual liberation moksha those things will not come going beyond suffering those things will not come it will not just not work if we are not fit for it we are not ready to assimilate it and that we understand any kind of knowledge you go to a university medical school or physics department or something something sophisticated something very deep unless one is equipped we won't we won't understand what's going on there and here the equipment which is going to talk about it's not just some prior knowledge you know this and then you come to my class no there's some there's a moral ethical preparation there's a certain maturity which is to be had after that vedanta comes so that he will discuss the second bad effect which can come if we are not fit is suppose the knowledge is transmitted to somebody who's not fit and now that person becomes the authority about that knowledge begins to teach a distorted version and in even harmful version to other people that can happen and it has happened again and again in the past so uh that's why yama puts naji keta through this test now what is this qualification and why is it important so these qualifications are the fourfold qualifications which we have studied in vedanta when you start studying vedanta the first thing that you actually study are these fourfold qualifications the first is viveka discernment between the eternal and the non-eternal put it even more generally between that spiritual reality and our mundane reality that there is such a thing even though i do not know god i do not know myself as brahman but by listening to this by looking at our spiritual tradition and all of the spiritual traditions i have a general belief that there is something very valuable to this perhaps much more valuable than whatever i have in this life so that's one the second one follows from this uh dispassion dispassion not towards brahman dispassion towards the world so this passion for the world that all the things that i have in this world have not provided me with lasting satisfaction have not taken me um across suffering well they have done a little bit for me not really because they're temporary because they are insubstantial and transient once they're gone they're really gone whether it is money or health or you know stock market options or my job or my status or uh husband wife children parents when they're gone it's gone just some fading memories are left so it does not give anything permanent to me this the what the world can give this is called seeing the insubstantiality the transience of worldly things because things in the world do not last therefore i have dispassion for them i have consciously or unconsciously tried to make myself happy how long have you tried it as far as i remember all my life from my babyhood to childhood to teenage to um youth and middle age and old age in whatever way that came to me i've been struggling with trying to overcome dissatisfaction unhappiness and attain some kind of fulfillment some kind of happiness some kind of satisfaction everything has been sort of sand slipping through my fingers it is nothing has stuck nothing nothing remains and if i go on in this way i see no hope of doing anything better that's the sign of sanity they say the sign of insanity is keeping on doing the same thing and expecting different results that's the that is the condition of samsara we keep on repeating the same things and we expect different results it won't work so this is dispassion for the non-eternal the non-spiritual the mundane and this goes within turning towards the spiritual then comes discipline so this is discernment dispassion third is discipline and that's a set of six so there's a little bit of cheating going on here they put in six they've said it's number three but it's uh there's six in that and we know these are six disciplines uh shama mental gratitude mental calmness settledness not restlessness then dhamma an actual control over our body our sense organs physical organs then uparati are careful withdrawing from too much engagement with the word careful withdrawing from too much engagement with the world and all these things we have studied in vedanta in fact this is where some vedanta teachers will introduce uparati means sannyasa renunciation mankhur one meaning of parathy would be at this point you are expected to become a monk so that you are qualified for vedanta but basically what it means is whether you are formally a monk or not there is you require to step back a little from worldly engagements you plunge too much into the social scene you know then it's very difficult then number um for uh the the number four is this means a fortitude a spiritual fortitude no matter what the world throws at me and no matter what the problems in the world in my family in my physical health finances whatever it is i will perceive here in my spiritual quest specifically my vedantic quest but anyway in general spiritual quest i will perceive it i will not sacrifice spiritual usually spirituality is the first thing that is sacrificed when there is trouble a little fever so today i need not do my meditation i have an excuse i have a little fever uh i remember somebody was aghast when i talked kovid first hit last year uh this person said that you're talking about vedanta now swami he was appalled in this time of crisis you're talking about vedanta as if the idea is vedante is this a leisure activity you know this nice philosophy talk you go to once in a while you attend lectures by public intel intellectuals by eminent speakers but of course you won't do that when you are in serious trouble you have to confront this trouble so why redundant in the time of kovid no vedanta is this is the time for vedanta this is the time for spirituality bitter spirituality does not work in this time it's not worth anything it just becomes you know a little bit of philosophical self-history or logic chopping no it must work it must help me when i'm in trouble so i'm vivekanthu says in one place he says i do not care for that religion which cannot wipe the widow's tears and hold a piece of bread to a starving man's lips and yet promises heaven after death he was criticizing the lack of social consciousness of the hindus at that time so he's it must help me spiritually psychologically even in in this in this world it must be it must give me strength so uh titiksha strength and then there is samadhana focus yes i am reducing my external activities i am controlling my senses calming my mind but to do what you are clearing the decks for action what is to be done focus focus on spiritual life focus on your vedantic study focus on your meditation focus on your devotional practices focus on your altruistic selfless action the four yogas so samadhana settle down on on spiritual on the spiritual quest and then shraddha shraddha is a deep abiding faith that what the texts say is right what the teacher says is right enough to sustain me through this long and arduous spiritual quest and then finally very important literally means desire for moksha desire for liberation desire for spiritual freedom how much do i want it now yama will actually test this sri ramakrishna said of all of these things the most important is the most important suramar krsna's language was vyakulata which is a bengali word which means your desperation your intense passion for god whether it's on the path of knowledge or path of devotion the intense desire i must see god it's possible to see god i must see god in this very life this intense desire all the other things you know the four-fold qualifications discernment dispassion the six-fold treasures which are disciplines basically and the desire for freedom if the desire for freedom is intense all the others will come now suppose that's all right but my desire is a little mild so desire for spiritual freedom is a little mild then what do i do then you have to start at the other end strengthen the discernment see the there is an interesting link between these one of the recent shankaracharya of sringari he has written a commentary on the vivek chodamani and there he says there's a secret to be understood about this about these fourfold qualifications it's not just given as a an ask list whether you have it or not if you don't have it goodbye if you have it you can come for the vedanta class no there is a way to cultivate these what is the way to cultivate these each one is causally linked to the preceding one i'll repeat that the secret is each one of the four is causally linked to the preceding one causally linked means the preceding one is the cause the succeeding one is an effect intense desire to be free you're telling me that's the most important thing yes but my desire to be free is not intense my love for god is not intense then what do i do is it hopeless no strengthen those disciplines strengthen those disciplines six the six-fold treasure calm down the mind live a life of simplicity and austerity self-control then spiritual toughness then withdraw from too much engagement with worldly activities then focus on vedanta have a firm faith in the teachings of vedanta it is difficult oh really then the earlier step vairagya a dispassion look into the faults of the of worldliness look around you look around you as a monk i come across many many people from especially these days they're connected to the whole world all walks of life and all kinds of people and the one thing that emerges from all of this is the faults of worldliness if you just listen to all of this from one end to the other the whole spectrum you will be first thing you will get is dispassion so this dispassion no i don't have too much dispassion i have some dispassion i don't think really the world can give me happiness but still there are i am pretty attached to the world then go further back viveka discernment eternal non-eternal brahman in the world spirituality versus the mundane life yes but how do i develop that vedanta study vedanta the more you listen to this more you think about it study the lives of the saints study devotional texts study vedantic texts that itself will give you the qualifications you see you say qualifications to enter vedanta but if you study vedanta it may not work the more you more you listen the more it will begin to take hold in hindi they have a term it's not digested it will be digested if you if you stay with it it will begin to take effect i remember when we were new brahmacaris just joined the order um in one ashram where i was there for some some time there was a great panditus to come and teach and all the monks those who were ordained with you know the swamis they used to go and attend the class in that ashram and we the newcomers we were encouraged we didn't understand anything but we were encouraged come sit listen you you will you'll get it slowly little by little you'll understand so the fourfold qualifications and ultimately there must be an intense desire to break free of of this this dissatisfactory state of affairs and that is what yama is is testing him yama is going to test um let us see he you know when we studied economics the first thing we were taught in the economics class is demand and demand and supply so demand in the microeconomics class and i still remember the teacher wrote demand is equal to desire plus ability to play pay plus willingness to pay so desire we have desire for so many things the entire you know you walk down fifth avenue here people have desired for so many things all on the shopping nicely displayed there this that that all are nice fancy things desire is there is that demand does that do any good to the shopkeeper no i have desired for a lot of that but of course i don't have a dollar in my pocket and no good the shopkeeper is not interested in me but i have desire and i have the money all right so will you pay for it no i have desire but not enough desire to pay for all these trinkets i don't want to waste my valuable money buying all this uh these trinkets then that's also not demand for the shopkeeper for the shopkeeper demand is when you want something then you have the ability to pay for it and you're willing to pay for it so you then what you do you want it you can buy it and you do you are willing to buy it and you go in there and you buy it now yama is testing naji keta so does he have the capacity to demand vedanta does he want it first and does he want it enough to is he capable and is he willing to put forth that effort so you want it enough to put forth that much effort and at all is he capable at all so he now tests and remember this is something we see now also i've seen in monastic orders in our order for example the monks keep talking about spirituality god realization spiritual practice and so on and so forth but when the young man comes up at the monastery and wanting to be a monk he's in for a surprise because then the monks seem to backpedal they say are you sure give it some time think about it i had a friend so they will discourage at first what's the point of discussing not that they don't want the young man to be a monk if that young man wants to be a mug very good but one must be absolutely sure and we say on your own power not because i told you or somebody inspired you then you can blame that person later on things don't work out no you must come into a monastery on your own power that means on your um you want it very badly that's why you are here not that we we called you in we told you to stay so i have a friend who is a doctor an md anesthesiologist and so he told me how he became a monk he was inspired he came to the main our main monastery in belur and he went to a very senior swami there the general secretary of the order why have you come i want to join and be a monk and he said sit down here and then he said that the general secretary of the order the order which have come with such great hopes to become a monk of he gave me a half an hour lecture on the disadvantages of monastic life and then after that he said so what do you think are you going to be a monk now and my friend said yes i want to be a monk and the general secretary said very good you go and go there and you join that place yes so it's a test yama is going to test nachiketa this is mantra number 21. [Music] with regard to this even the gods entertain doubts in days of yore for being subtle this substance the self is not truly comprehended ask for some other boon do not press me give up this boon that is demanded of me so the lord of death says in ancient times even the gods what to speak of ordinary people or a little boy like you even the gods were confused about this uttara means here here means in this issue in this question what you have asked me about the atma about the atman gods where even the gods were confused about this the nature of ultimate reality who we really are what's going on here what's the ultimate reality about life even the gods were deluded who are the gods gods with small g the devatas they are beings like us but far superior to us and so they have been born with divine bodies due to a lot of good past karma so they live in heaven heavens multiple heavens are there and so on so they're very very powerful beings yama is one of them yamaha the lord of death is one of those gods one of the powerful ones now for example in the keno upanishad which we will do later in the canaan upanishad you find the gods are puzzled by the nature of ultimate reality ultimate reality brahman appears before them and then the story is that this nice little story the gods think what is this what's this reality what's this amazing being which has appeared and they asked the god of of fire um go and find out who who this being is the god of fire goes there before he can speak this amazing being who's none other than brahman the ultimate reality asks who are you what's your power and the god of fire says i am fire and i can burn anything in this universe and then brahman that strange being you know he throws down a piece of straw and says burn this and fire you know blaze force all kinds very high temperatures blazing fire nothing happened the straw was wasn't even singed so he admitted defeat and he returned unable to understand who that ultimate reality is or that that being is then they asked the god of wind why you go there and find out who this strange being is and the god of wind rushed there in all enthusiasm and the same thing happened brahman asked that god who are you and what's your power your superpower and why you says i can i am the god of wind i can blow away anything in this universe well blow away this piece of straw and he huffed and puffed and tried his best but the little piece of straw didn't move so he was defeated he came back and so on and then the lord of all the gods indra the king of gods he goes and so on what's the point of that story there's an inner meaning to that the gods there symbolize the different powers of our indriyas the power to see hear smell taste touch to think comprehend none of them can objectify or capture brahman you can't see brahman you can't and so on not only that the deeper meaning of that is all those powers come from brahman like the power of the fire god to burn the power of the wind god to blow things away all powers originate from one ultimate reality and that is you actually you shining your eyes have the capacity of seeing and get the experience of seeing you pure consciousness shining through the mind and through the ears you have the capacity of experiencing sound taste smell um touch give the capacity of thinking and understanding and remembering and desiring and hating all of these experiences are possible because pure consciousness atman brahman same thing that's your real nature you shine upon this conglomerate of mind and the senses that's the meaning of the story but also it's also true that the gods were puzzled and in the end of the story the gods were illumined so a set of the highest gods indra and this yama so they they they were ultimately illumine so they realized that we are brahman that's why yama is a teacher that's why he can teach he's not confused himself uh so he says but the gods were confused about this in ancient times and i gave you one story of how the gods were confused about the nature of ultimate reality why were they confused no suvi gayum it is not easily understood it cannot be truly comprehended truly complemented and easily understood easily understood means it's it's very subtle that fights cannot be easily understood truly comprehended means it cannot be made an object of a determinative knowledge that means this is it because all this is it is powered by that one consciousness you cannot reduce gold to one type of ornament yes gold is a bracelet could be any other thing but it's basically a bracelet no it isn't um so what should we do and why is it difficult to understand anuresha dharma here dharma means the atman see dharma normally means the code of morality ethics and adharma means being immoral or unethical uh here it applies to the atman in fact multiple meanings are there of dharma just like karma for example multiple meanings yoga for example multiple meanings dharma has the largest number of meanings one meaning is of course religion morality ethics another meaning is the the the good karma in sanskrit punya the good karma that one gets by performing vedic rituals which will take you to heaven after death that's a very specific meaning of dharma then another meaning of dharma is a sentient being jivas we are all dharmas manduka karika uses that in that that sense that all beings these are called dharmas there are other meanings which are given in buddhism every particle of reality is called dharma for example in buddhism certain schools of buddhism here atma itself is called dharma the ultimate reality is called the dharma why would you say why so many meanings isn't this is there something common to all of them there is [Music] means to hold the etymological meaning of dharma is to hold together so you look at the uses morality or ethics holds society civilization together and gives personal integrity your dharma is that which gives integrity to your character that's the meaning of dharma that which holds things together um every object has its own dharma the sentient being the jiva is what holds this body mind together and that's why we have this life of our own and ultimately it is atman which holds everything together because it is the reality of all things so in every case it is etymological you can derive why they are called dharma anyway that discussion aside this dharma that means atman is exceedingly subtle anu means atom so it's exceedingly atomic means not small not tiny atman is vast all pervading not limited by time space or object true but here it means subtle because atoms are subtle in that sense subtle therefore cannot be known as an object and is not easy to know because of its subtlety and then he says ask for something else ask for something else why ask for something else because it's difficult because it may not give any result shankaracharya explains this in his commentary don't waste a boom you're a clever boy you asked for good things the first boon and second boon so you are really good at this but don't waste this you are going to get if you ask me i'll give you a vedanta class but you've just wasted a boon on a vedanta class so ask for something else and he knows yama knows that he is cup he's got because he has promised to give nashiketa whatever he asked so he next he pleads for nashiketa to let him off the hook as americans would say do not press me on this do not push me on this adima don't press me let me off let me off this you know because i have promised you if you really want it i'll have to speak to you about it but it's difficult you probably won't get it and you have wasted the um the boon and later on in other verses coming mantras he will say not only is it difficult it's useless this vedanta knowledge is useless ask for like useful stuff you know really money and things like that you ask for that i'll give you all that nugi keta however see here is the character of naji keta let's look at the verse number 22. devatra [Music] even the gods entertain doubt with regard to this thing and oh death since you two say that it is not truly comprehended and since any other instructor like you of this thing is not to be had therefore there is no other boon comparable to this one what a wonderful turnaround he is playing jiu-jitsu with uh the lord of death he says precisely you said it's difficult even the gods were confused confused about this precisely that's why i want one to know about this and uh so it just because the gods were confused on this question who am i the ultimate reality of the self um and you have just said you the lord of death you have just said it's difficult uh then i will not get another teacher like you vactaca as you are the lord of death you are enlightened yourself you know what happens after death you know what remains in all this coming and going this whirling circle of life is there any reality beyond this who will know better than you and i've got you if you don't tell me you're you're promised and you don't if you if i don't learn it from you i can let go of this opportunity i'll never i'll never get the answer to this question there is no other also there is no other boon equal to this there is nothing as good as this as great as this this is the most precious knowledge is the most precious acquisition that one can have in all the lives of of you know which we have gone through there's nothing greater to be had i've shared with you once the discussion i had with professor parimal patel at harvard university he asked this rhetorical question why if so few people become enlightened so difficult why would anybody enter the spiritual quest and i gave him two answers he gave me a third one i have said this earlier but let me just quickly summarize he he i said well it's not that people do not get enlightenment's difficult to get no everybody will get enlightenment all will get enlightenment why not it's our real nature what could prevent us from getting that other things we may or may not get but this we will we are bound to get it this life next life sometimes so this is guaranteed when we don't know but it's guaranteed it will happen then the second reason i gave was why should one come into spiritual path once you have got a taste of the spiritual path what will you do what else will you do what compares to this the more we appreciate this what else will you do we have to pursue this path this is the greatest of human adventures it's the final adventure actually this you know the mystery of this universe mystery of ourselves what we are mystery of life and he said both of these are good questions with good answers but they are theoretical they are somewhat you know abstract i'll give you the real reason why people strict to spiritual life when they come to spirituality and they stick to spiritual life this is the professor said this and remember this is a discussion going on in at harvard university not even in the divinity school this was going on in the philosophy department emerson hall and he says that because day to day the strength that we get peace that we get from our spiritual practices from prayer and meditation and devotion this keeps us going we are getting benefits far before long before enlightenment long before god realization whatever is promised we are getting the benefit of that day to day so this keeps us going and that's a beautiful answer now he says um there is no other teacher like you there is no no human being can teach you like teach like god and certainly not like the god of death and you are an illumined being here i am again reminded of a similar incident which actually happened swami vivekananda one of his disciples so i'm vivekananda was very pleased with him in belude i think but definitely in calcutta and this he said to disciple ask for something i'll give you a boon today and the disciples said all right tell me what is maya not what is brahman what is maya and swami vivekananda did this exactly what yama is going to do he said ask me something else don't press me on this question and then the disciple said exactly what ya nazi keta said he said there is no other teacher like you if i don't get an answer to this question from you i'll never get an answer to this question so i want this exactly the words banishing educator used there's no other teacher like you there's no other question like this and there's nothing greater than this and if i don't get an answer from you i'll never get it in my life i want this and then the disciple says swami vivekananda began to speak and as i sat and listened i lost all sense of this external world even my body he says the room began to spin before my eyes and it melted away into uh you know like into light and my own body i couldn't feel it my body disappeared i couldn't see myself i couldn't see swami vivekananda either but i could keep i heard his voice in that void in that luminous void his voice was going on and i burst out i heard myself bursting out and saying swami all this is maya whatever you are doing preaching vedanta establishing this organization all this is maya and swami vivekananda and then he says i noticed i used the bengali diminutive in bengali the different or indian languages actually there are different ways you address superiors the teacher or you know people who are of equal rank or people who are you know your maybe children or social inferiors or something like that so multiple levels of inflection are there so in bengali apni in hindi op would be the way like as well you uh address a teacher a guru for example and this disciple says i heard myself using the the familiar term to me you which you use to your friends or you know people who are equal to you don't you don't certainly say that to your guru the moment he thought that you see this sense of difference distinction hierarchy the moment this thought came to him reality snapped back into place the apparent reality which we involved this came back the rope and the body and the they kind of sitting there looking at him smiling and vivek and they agreed they kind of answers this question yes you are right that is all maya if you can give it all up immerse yourself in meditation realize brahman be one with brahma and be done with all this but if you cannot vivek on the sage if you cannot then come and join me help in this noble work that's the best possible life you can have i mean this is my interpretation this much he says this is the story now if we are interested in so what exactly is it that vivekananda said i also want this world to disappear into a luminous mind and all that well luckily we have i mean the disciple himself has not given any details about what exactly it is that vivekananda said but we have vivekananda's lectures on maya three lectures on maya so i'm sure it must be some of that stuff which vivekananda said to his disciple at one point i decided to give a talk on maya sort of summarizing what swami vivekananda said in those lectures and then i was surprised to see recently that all the lectures i've given talks i've given which are in the vedantas of new york that is probably probably in one of the top three not because of what i said it's mostly what vivekananda said but it's because i think of the term maya everybody is interested more than atman brahman god it's maya people want to know what is it actually so nachiketa says there is no other teacher quite like you i want this then he says there is no other boon equal to this you said ask me for something else there's nothing else equal to this and yama says yama gets his q here the lord of death he says ah we'll see about that nothing equal to this let me give you the the catalogue i remember as a kid we didn't have these fancy catalogs in in those days in america the big um the shopping like sears and all they would have expensive catalogues so among the few people who i knew had gone abroad one of my friends so they had come back from germany and they had these expensive catalogues in one or two innis and i would live through that in surprising thing there's so many uh fine you know the catalog itself was so glossy and there's so many attractive looking things from furniture to gadgets and whatnot this means that so many things are available in the world so yamaha is going to pull out the sears catalog i said you think there's nothing equal to this you're a little boy you have no idea come here is amazon now you don't even need a catalog you just go to amazon and see what all is available though everything in the world is available for you you need of course desire plus ability to pay plus willingness to pay but everything is set out before you now yama is going to do that he's going to pull out the catalogue and show nachiketa what all is available what he could ask for 23. talk about temptation with a capital t and all this for a little boy yama says ask for sons and grandsons and that will that will be centenarians ask for many animals elephants and gold and horses and a vast expanse of the earth and you yourself live for as many years as you like so what all people could want family you want you know husbands wives children grandchildren and not only the children it you know he immediately he covers his you know he uh qualifies it by saying they will live for 100 years they will outlive you one of the most shocking things the greatest tragedies possible in human life is to lose a child grandparents die parents die that's in the natural course of things it's sad but to lose a child i mean one can only imagine how how devastating that is how shocking how tragic that is and so yama knows that and he says that you will have many children and grandchildren and they'll be all long-lived they will live for 100 years all of them and yeah but who's going to feed that brood who's going to educate them they're saying it costs a million dollars something like that to send two children to college here in the united states so who's going to i i don't know i mean something like that maybe so is who's going to take care of all of those children it will be a misery to have lots of children and no way to feed them and he says no here is vast wealth ask for wealth and all of this in one boon you can ask for all of this in one boom bahoon lots of cattle why cattle remember in those days cattle was wealth was equivalent to wealth like um it starts with the gift of cattle do you remember so cattle not just cattle elephants so it was a sign of prestige to own elephants what good are elephants no good that's the point you you have these magnificent beasts in your garage so it's not very different now you have this gas guzzling huge suvs or something you know it's like an elephant and from there that term has come white elephant which absorbs all of your resources and income doesn't do much so elephants ask for elephants um i remember once and in monasteries they measured their wealth and property by owning not only cattle but elephants i remember one head of a traditional monastery came to our monastery once in dyogra when i was a novice and so this head was a traditional monk so he has to establish his dominance over our head the head of our ashram so the first thing he asked in hindi kitne how many elephants do you have and the poor swami said well we have a few cows but no elephants so that's it you're defeated you don't have elephants i'm obviously a superior monk because i have elephants i remember once one of our swamis he was the head of our ashram in in chennai and from a traditional ashram there was a procession and the head of that ashram was going on on the back of an elephant and seeing the swami of our madras the madras monastery on this walking down in front of him there are a lot of other people also this other swami who was on sitting seated on the elephant he recognized oh this is the head of the local ramakrishna mission so he blessed him like this from the top of the elephant like this after all you're much higher on the elephant and our swami not to be undone uh not to be outdone he from the from there on the road he blessed him with both hands like this elephants i'm going to give you not only cattle but many elephants and horses and which is very expensive this is hiranyam lots of gold lots of money in today's world it would translate into you know cars and private jets and whatnot not horses and elephants but so on and lots and lots of money millions and billions of dollars and how would all this come bhumer mahadaya you will have a vast kingdom the commentator says that you'll be a king of a kingdom only kings would have such kind of property so that's what you will be ask for all of this and he knows you get all of this and you die quickly or you are sickly and old no you live as long as you like and i commented to that with perfect health with perfect health there's this popular saying you spend your health in earning money all your life work hard and ruin your health spend up your health and earning money and then spend all of your money in regaining your health and here yamaha says none of that you will be healthy you will live for 100 years so ask for this now we can ask ourselves if somebody comes and gives this you have an option either you get the knowledge of brahman which is basically a vedanta class and nothing more than that or you will become enormously wealthy and you will have a family large extended family and you will have all gadgets and houses and cars and everything and you'll be healthy and you'll live long it sounds tempting why would you want something like that some kind of abstract philosophy what what's the point take this all that we have to remember is this i'll give you a very good example suppose somebody says now i'll give you power and wealth and make you the president of the united states i'll give you a billion dollars and i'll give um you know you will have children and grandchildren all will be good and healthy and you'll be you know healthy and long-lived and all of that that sounds great ah but one thing it's all going to be a dream it'll be in your dream and the option is you can wake up one of the two either you wake up or i'll give you all this in your dream all of us will say oh that's no good not even everything that you can give in your dream you don't have to grip me i can imagine things in my dream also none of that counts to one second of wakefulness because it's not real that's not real vedanta is waking up to reality the rest of this is delusion there what yama is offering him is a string of zeros you want more zeros i'll give you more and more zeros what your nachiketa is asking for is the one so can't you have both you can have the one and all the zeros will come and quit it's not makes no difference to you or you can live in the realm of delusion in the house of maya in edmond arnold's translation and you know about the life of the buddha the house of maya you can have that but your problem with that is dreams will break one day and when they'll break they'll all be gone not only gone you will see it was never there at all it was a dream it was a delusion the whole thing was a waste or lord yama says that if there's anything else in your mind don't be shy ask me i'll give i give it to you 24 8 [Music] if you think some other boon to be equal to this ask for that ask for wealth and a long life own educator you can become a ruler over a vast region i make you fit i will make you fit for the enjoyment of all delectable things so either tullium if there's something else equal to what i have said i showed you the entire catalog is there anything else that you got in your mind i can get that for you too and you basically ask for vast wealth put together the wealth of all the billionaires bezos and bill gates and elon musk and all of that and all of that you'll get it live long jiraji we can live a long life as long as you want um be the emperor of the earth mahabh he'll rule over an empire for a long time there have been such people so do that i will make you the enjoyer of all desires whatever you can desire and all of that in one boon this over eagerness of yama is itself suspicious you know he's trying to pull a fast one on you he's getting desperate he'll just basically give you anything in this universe but don't ask me for that it just increases your interest your eagerness to know that oh that one thing this is a theme in the open bishops the great sage yagya valkyr who is the hero of the brihadnakupanisha which will get to hopefully something [Music] the lord willing uh at the end of his career as a teacher he decides to become a monk and he had two wives he renounces life i mean the worldly life and he divides his wealth among the two wives one of the wives there's katyayani and maitrey one of the wise katyan is happy she's got um you know all the bank accounts and the mansions and the cars i think he was a sage i don't think he'd had much anyway but anyway so but apparently it was quite well to do he got a lot of government grants from the kings and the emperors and the other wife maitrey is intrigued said why are you doing this husband you're giving up all of this comfort and luxury and everything and going off into the forest to do what what is that you're seeking for which you are giving everything away all this which you are dividing with you know and giving me my share will it give me that which you are seeking and yagya velka was very pleased with this question and he says my dear whatever um i'm giving you this will give you comfort in this world as long as you're alive it'll it'll make for a comfortable life yes it is true money makes for a comfortable life when we are sick money makes for a comfortable hospital bed and little less misery while dying that's it so this is what what my wealth can do for you but it will not give you immortality it will not give unlock the secret of the universe it will not take you beyond the shores of samsara into freedom which is what i am seeking or what i am going into then my tray asks him i want that i don't want this wealth and then he instructs and that's the famous um dialogue actually there's a dialogue between husband and wife yagya valkyrie and my three similarly here naturiketa is being tempted all desires whatever possible desires i'm offering you but don't ask for that one this interesting phrase come on i'll make you the enjoyer of all desires it's a bit like like you know in today's world amazon prime all desires are there before you so if you have got enough money you can keep on buying at least you can do computer shopping looking around spend your days this is nice that is nice this is what he is offering now we will see he will offer something even more attractive next that we will see next time let me see the comments prabhupad was saying what is the sold of this source of these fourfold qualifications is it coming from the upanishads yes it's coming from the upanishads it's not in one place it's collected from the upanishads so it's in the later texts like vedanta you will say sadhan jato shtaya sampana quali with a four-fold qualification but if you trace it back it's been collected from different operations this upanishad for example it tests your dispassion vairagya it tests your eagerness to attain enlightenment that's why i said initially it's good to study a text like vedanta which is sort of a finished system it seems very neat geometrical but you have to now we are going back to the source the upanishads themselves so it will seem rather messy but this is the original it's from this that this whole system of vedanta has emerged in time then alpana is asking what if the desire for liberation is getting lesser because the understanding is not to be sought it's ours to begin with getting lesser in the sense if you find it it's wonderful that i've got it but lesser in the sense that now i'm getting mixed up with the world again then it's then you're asking for trouble it's like i know this is a dream and i know i can wake up well let me dream a little more then it's not working there should be an intense desire to wake up first what will happen in that case is will still continue to be spiritual but time will pass and will not come into any kind of solid realization this life will pass away next life will come back with a more intense desire to realize god that's what will happen sean lee says how can i show dispassion to the mundane life as we are living in the worldly life because you're living in the worldly life you don't have a mundane life then you can't show dispassion towards it in the middle of that life only you can show dispassion see um there's so many people who in who are householders but enlightened and always say krishna the teacher and arjuna the student both of them are householders you're yama the teacher he's a householder he's a god but he's a householder he's not a monk most of the vedic rishis from whom the upanishads came they're householders actually as you mentioned the more we listen to vedanta be spiritual then we can be dispassionate to the worldly life to become dispassionate to early life is the goal of life no to become enlightened is the goal of life dispassion is only the way of entangling yours disentangling yourself from the net of samsara the whole problem is we are consciousness it's entangled with the body and mind entanglements not don't think of it as physically entangled it's just our misunderstanding it's just our ignorance and but that becomes the basis of early life that i am a mixture of consciousness i understand consciousness but i feel i am a mixture of consciousness and mind and body senses and this person so from there to coming to realization i am consciousness and consciousness alone the whole thing appears in me the consciousness this this entanglement this is possible it requires a little dispassion towards things which we are entangled with gaurav says i have the same question like when we understand that what i need to attain is already attained any form of apparent attainment is at the level of transactional world the desire for liberation at least reduces a lot is mumuk shuttle preliminary qualification which vanishes after understanding vedanta ultimately it will vanish because you realize you are ever free but only if you realize before that if it vanishes it just shows the uh like it is feeble is feeble if my thirst is satisfied by the picture of a bottle of water i have seen what water is like good i don't want any more water then i was not really thirsty to begin with so i don't want to just see the bottle of water i want to open it i want to drink it and want to quench my thirst that kind of eagerness must be there yes in one ultimate sense you are right both gaurav and alpha are right if you look at enlightened persons the jeevan muktas so do they have the driving urge burning urge for god realization no there comes a time when they are fulfilled when they are at peace if they are always desperate for god realization till the very end of their lives and they don't there's nobody to demonstrate the fulfillment of a given book then it would be a rather unpleasant kind of path but there is an end to it we were reading in the gospel of srinamar krishna yesterday he says there is an end to spiritual striving when it becomes natural the presence of god is naturally felt or that i am the atman is naturally realized rita the word assimilate is used often in reference to absorbing some teachings it seems to be a very important word but the meaning is not very clear the nutrition for example it means one thing in social sciences the word assimilate may refer to process by which an immigrant changes behaviors to fit in with the larger group in vedanta does it mean that a person who used to have a temper is now more patient this exercise is samadhana could it be that assimilated teaching means to transform the character both nutrition it means one thing and social science is another thing these are good examples assimilate means make the teaching your own it's no longer a definition you know what is vivek or what is dispassion and discernment it's no longer a definition i i learned in a textbook or heard from a vedanta teacher i actually feel it it's no no longer that i and begin to understand that i may i'm not exactly the body i'm the witness of the body but it becomes a fact for me another um characteristic of assimilation is as you said it's a good example social sciences you change your behaviors to assimilate our behaviors change because of our understanding so this new understanding this new realization let us say it will change our behavior our behavior right now is dictated by a kind of realization our realization right now is that i am the body and therefore i behave like this when i really understand or see that i am not the body when i really feel god exists and i am in the presence of god all the time or that ultimate reality is existence consciousness place and that is not a phrase a catchphrase no i feel that then my behavior has to change it'll automatically flow from there so that's then that sense also assimilation is correct i mentioned it in another um context then that um in one of the classes in the harvard divinity school on buddhism there was this there was a paper which just discussed two views of enlightenment one you might call a paradigm shift view another one you might call the ethical manifestation view i think the words speak for themselves the paradigm shift view is that um that was a buddhist thing but i'm putting it in vedantic terms i am not oh i'm not the body and mind which i thought which was my paradigm earlier i am pure being pure awareness oh these people and this world is not separate from me they are all i alone and appearing in this way oh i am not a limited being born aging and dying i am immortal this paradigm shift not just reading about it but you see it for as now this is your reality shifts this is the reality this is one type of assimilation this is basically this is enlightenment but there's another meaning of enlightenment in the buddhist paradigm in the buddhist context are you able to show the compassion the purity of character the utter self-control of a buddha then you are enlightened not just because your paradigm has shifted or whatever so ethical manifestation model and both of these are combined when swami vivekananda says religion is the manifestation of the divinity already within us so the manifestation of the divinity already within us a magnificent definition of spirituality you must know this your paradigm must shift i'm of the nature of shiva i am of the nature of consciousness i am of the nature of unlimited fulfillment this paradigm shift must come but also it must be expressed in thought word and deed swami vivekande said my mission in life can be put in a few words it is to teach unto mankind their inner divinity and how to make it manifest in every movement of life so that is in both senses assimilation will assimilation is a lower stage of this and this is of course i'm talking about enlightenment [Music] one needs to assimilate spiritual ideas correct punita ji is asking is rita's question related to what you have conveyed to us and sadhu's reminders about honoring knowledge gained that's where the shoe pinches for many of us correct honoring the knowledge gain means we know enough we know a lot especially these days vast amounts of spiritual noises spiritual supermarket are available to us yet we can put into practice that is manifest in our lives only a tiny fraction of it compare it to the lives of many saints um it's they're not in how many books they have read read but how much compassion they had how much purity of character they had so that they were able to manifest much more so anyway kind of says an ounce of practice worth 10 20 tons of tall talk so this is the difference between manifestation and honoring the knowledge gain honoring the knowledge gained is a struggle before enlightenment but before that honoring the knowledge gained a struggle because when we try to honor it that means hold on to it in our day to day lives immediately all our past conditioning comes up and there's this huge battle lord buddha's mother's name was maya maya devi jennifer said one of my teachers told me that one must want enlightenment as much as a drowning man wants it's a classic example we must drop the world as if it's burning hot plate yes these are two classic examples in vedanta the teacher who takes the student the students asking why don't i realize god teacher takes him and you know sort of dunks him in water in the river doesn't allow him to come up and when he comes up gasping for air teacher said how did you feel the student said i could have given anything for one breath of air so when you feel like that you want god like that when you're gasping for god you will realize god the other example is deep tashira with your head on fire imagine this your hair is on fire and you want to jump in the nearest pool of water so this is the burn with that kind of a burning question you go to the teacher um krishnamurti vishwanathan says the kakara that means suresh shankaracharya's student explains it in one of his works that one experiences complete peace when the realized person digests the punch and makes it part of his own yes he has said it in the is just like the physical body digests food and is no longer troubled by it so it's a beautiful question we'll i'll leave you with that he asks the question he says can you eat up the universe can you digest it in your tummy you can put the whole universe in your tummy what he means is the moment you realize your brahman your existence itself a whole universe floats in you like a shadow not like a boat in water it's like a shadow in you you are the reality of this universe then you can be said to have gulped down the universe and digested propane to the whole universe in your tummy that's what he means is [Music] foreign [Music] you