Video 104

The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna read by Swami Atmajnanananda (7/29/22)

foreign [Music] [Music] Souls they're praised by Poets and rainbow sin they are auspicious to hear wonderful and exalted those who spread these words throughout the world are truly giving Souls welcome everyone to our class on the gospel of seven Krishna we've been going through the chapter with the devotees that dakshineswar part two and with the Day this Sunday December 16 1883 page 345. and you'll remember that this is part of M's long stay with shramakrishna dakshineswar and if it seems that this is a very important period for training m and not just for he knows that he'll be the the recorder of his words but I think for him spiritual life and I very much this big question of uh balance between monastic life and householder life and and represents a rather unique case where he had the mindset of a monk and the desire longing to be among and yet was living the life of the householder his wife children profession and everything teacher and there was always a dilemma and it seems that ramakrishna encouraged him on both sides almost sometimes it almost seems like he's encouraging him to renounce everything and become a monk and at the same time he's telling him uh live in the world do your duties uh do everything and it detach spirit so it's it's almost seems as if he represents a different category sometimes we use this term grihi sannyasi the householder slash Monk and so some of the advice that drama Krishna gives to m uh Sam's very strong and harsh almost as if it should just be given to these young boys and at other times he'll tell him go back home live with your with your fathers and the family and and well and and many times it seems and really uh almost made sure of a Krishna for permission to renounce to become a monk and had tremendous respect and a little bit of envy you could say for the young boys who renounced everything and they recognize that as a very high ideal so we'll come across some things in this chapter that uh seem to be almost a mixed message to him but Tucker he knew what he was doing and he really wanted to to keep him in the world as a special example of of someone who can live like among but live the householder life it was evening the ceramic question was meditating on the Divine mother and chanting her holy name the devotees also went off to solitary places and meditated on their chosen ideals evening worship began at the temple Garden in the shrine of Kali Radha Krishna and Shiva now when when we read this is almost impossible to imagine the thick spiritual atmosphere huh that what it would have been like to seize ramakrishna meditating and Jenny the name of God every time we read about pakur in his room at Sunset we know he goes into a special spiritual mood at that time and for others to be around they'll feel that there's the the feel that when we go to the dakshineswar even today without shramakrishna being present in the physical body we feel that the tremendous atmosphere of that place it was the second day of the dark Fortnight of the Moon soon the moon Rose in the sky bending temples trees flowers and the Rippling surface of the Ganges in its light the master was sitting on the couch an m on the floor the conversation turned to the vedanta Master 2m why should the universe be unreal now this is a theme that runs through the entire Gospel of Sharma Krishna again another another Balancing Act to what extent do we want to call this world unreal to what extent do we benefit from it and to what extent is that something preliminary is is the final ideal what does unreal mean uh does it mean really unreal when we say like a dream does it mean really that when we wake up we'll find that nothing really happened it was all imagination uh does it mean dream like that uh it just has a certain quality to it of unreality doesn't mean just transitory so it's a very big issue when Surah Krishna says why should the universe be unreal he's taking this in the sense of imaginary why because there are some schools that really say just the projection of the Mind uh because I the the I the idea that the world is unreal in terms of transitory it's drama Christian accepted 100 that was really I think his his understanding of the uh unreality of the world as as compared to the reality of Brahman the changeful nature of it and the fleeting nature of it and nothing really that we can hold on to and cling to everything will leave us or we'll leave everything we can take it one way or the other uh and uh depending on on the nature of the of the devotee and their spiritual path uh it will either be helpful or not helpful to think of the world as unreal uh the advantage of course is that we can lose a little bit of of the strong attachment and even addiction to the world we if we start thinking of this world that our electronic I think it likes this idea that's a unsubstantial there's a little Hollow not nothing of of Eternal lasting value in this world uh the things that are lasting value are all the interior things that they love love within heart is love of God this divine presence these are the important things but this is Alter M the other name is a little philosophical he had read cons in Hegel and this a lot of this this idea of the uh that we never know the thing in itself that we only see appearances of this idea so surama Krishna was really telling him why should the universe be unreal that means why should one take that attitude why should one take that attitude that that is the speculation of the philosophers now I was curious about a lot of these things so sometimes I go back to the original Bengali that we get it we get a better idea that uh especially with regard to this this unreality that I'm always curious is it anity is it assat and everything so he's saying so this is the extreme form it's not simply Assad it's not simply Anita it's not simply a vastu but this is mithya somehow false or somehow like we're seeing uh an oasis in the desert just as a mirage somehow so Taco never took it to that extreme that he liked more this idea everything this Divine manifestation then he says I like the English translation it's beautiful that that is the speculation of the philosophers but it carries it I think slightly different meaning when it says that this is something that belongs to the realm of each other that means that there's something positive about that we say it's just a philosophy it kind of dismisses it but takur always says that at the time of each other at the time of uh analyzing things then we have to make a distinction between what is eternal and what is changing the distinction between uh what has some real substance and what is is fleeting make these types of distinctions that's the type of each other that we have to analyze so use that so uh that is the speculation of the philosophers on the one hand it's it it captures a little bit this idea that don't get too involved with this philosophy and when Tucker uses this word Vitara with regard to M most of the time he's telling him don't do it don't get carried away with too much philosophical speculation worry more about developing developing Devotion to God and everything so it has a little bit of that sense also after realizing God one sees that it is God himself who has become the universe and all living beings so this again this is that going up and coming down that takur said that there's there's a reason why we make this distinction between sat and Assad real and unreal because now we confuse them we don't we don't have that power to distinguish that which is especially with regard to ourselves we've lost this ability to to understand ourselves as this unchanging Eternal self and we confuse it with the mind and the and the ego and personality and all of that so we have to try to make that distinction uh this this is how we thought it is helpful for us so when takur says let's just be taught it doesn't mean that it's it's useless it serves a great purpose I I mentioned earlier that the Swami protection says that through which order we can't realize the highest truth but we can eliminate all these false ideas and that's enough once we've eliminated the ultimate truth will reveal itself and it will be Beyond philosophy and everything so this was uh srirama krishna's uh it's world view and his attitude I won't say it was his philosophical position because I don't believe he had any one philosophical position and he equally liked all the different schools of philosophy and all the different paths and found each one to be appropriate for a different type of person and he followed all of them and liked all of them that's why he used to say that when the mother prepares fish she'll prepare for all the different different children that are like different taste and everything and then he says I like all fish preparations so that meant that he liked all these different he practices highly dualistic types of spiritual practices as well as the Dwight davidanta and everything so it's not that he had any one philosophical position but he he had a world of you that he was comfortable with and that was mostly this idea of the Divine mother and seeing everything is a manifestation of the Divine mother he appreciated all these other ideas but some of them he felt were preliminary some were helpful some were just uh will appear appeal to other people but this is the seems to be the one that appealed to him the most so he'll talk about that a little the Divine mother revealed to me in the Kali Temple that it was she who had become everything she showed me that everything was full of consciousness now this chinmaya when we hear this term full of Consciousness it doesn't mean that these things are conscious because it's another possible misunderstanding that oh is the chair conscious somehow this idea some type of it's very hard to to conceive of it some type of idea that Consciousness uh congail somehow the closest we can come I think is in the dream if we what is an object in a dream that we if we analyze it we'll find that ultimately somehow it's it's uh it's it's a thought object it's an ideal it doesn't have any independent material existence that's a that's as far as we can go with this mithya idea for ishrama Krishna all right and the upanishads we have this idea every new projection out of Brahman but we also have this idea that what's projected out of brahmana is is the is the different elements and they combine and and it's more or less an independent universe we find this idea that uh when mermaid and then what emerges first is is of the elements and each one says the same thing and the other elements come so this chin Maya not exactly everything's full of Consciousness but it's somehow the embodiment of Consciousness or composed of Consciousness means composed of of clay so somehow composed of Consciousness this is this is something that uh it'll almost Beyond philosophy and this is the the experience of the of of the mystics this is mine raises goes to a higher level we can understand it slightly with our sense of reason with analogies to dream and things like that but this was a living experience Divine mother revealed to me and the Kali Temple that it was she who had become everything now merman doesn't become anything yeah so this this again if we we get we get mired down in philosophy too much foreign also means the Divine mother and then we're free from all of this uh Brahman can't change or do anything then we have this at least the Shakti aspect that this or the cosmic mind aspect somehow that this can be responsible for for this entire universe [Music] yeah all pervading Universal consciousness yeah we have different ideas what does it mean for something to pervade something else there are different ways of understanding it if you have if you have water and you throw some salt and that sold eventually will will be present everywhere in the water it'll be all pervasive you won't be able to find any any area of water that doesn't have salt in it the upanishadic idea is more that just as gold will pervade jewelry that means there's nothing other than the gold plus name and form so it's not like there's there's jewelry and then gold pervades it enters into it somehow so all preventing Consciousness is another way of saying chinmaya it's be with Consciousness and if we if we take this universe as something uh independent and separate and real and material and then Consciousness will go and enter into each and every cell of it like that it doesn't make sense to us all right now it may be if we want to say like the sun shining on all objects Illuminating everything equally we could say something like that if we want but generally this idea of of all pervasiveness that we have navidante is more this idea of gold and uh jewelry that there's nothing separate yes example of his nephews that um he was communicating with leaves and everything but don't disturb I'm going to catch the butterfly yeah or a little boy yeah he's playing with his dog yeah yeah yeah and also a little bit of this idea there can be Shakti and objects of the rock can jump up and something like that yeah but not exactly the same and he was trying to say that the childlike nature seeing Consciousness everywhere yeah yeah but we run into problems if we start thinking that then we go to things like like rocks and stones in a mountain how do we divide it into each rock is it how does it work that way generally pedantic idea will be more that uh unless an object has something that can reflect consciousness a little bit of that idea of the container with the water and everything uh plants they have some ability they have something almost equivalent to a nervous system so they do have some access some ability to uh maybe not awareness as we know it but to go towards the light and for the roots to go towards water uh some some idea we know so many experiments were done that way that some some kind of access at least to Consciousness Jada that we don't know if there's any such thing as conscious you know there's a very nice verse from the bhagavadra that says that God [Music] thinks in man he moves in animals he feels in plants and sleeps in Stones something like that yeah so that we if we want to say Consciousness dwells within all things but uh it's as if non-existent almost in in Judah things like that yeah these are all kind of speculation but this idea of all pervasiveness generally means that everything is a manifestation of the Divine in that that sense so the Divine mother revealed to me in the Kali Temple that it was she who had become everything she showed me that everything was full of consciousness the image was Consciousness the altar was Consciousness the water vessels were Consciousness not exactly where Consciousness but we're all composed of Consciousness somehow some some congealed consciousness uh the doors of his Consciousness the marble floor of its Consciousness all of its Consciousness I found everything inside the room soaked as it were in Bliss the Bliss of sachidananda I saw a wicked man in front of the Kali Temple but in him also I saw the power of the Divine mother vibrating so these are related but different related but different we can say that all of these objects are not or they're all China but the actual living presence of the Divine as the self within that's also a different type of experience yeah I I fully accept this example of the gold yeah right right what what exactly does it mean when it says [Music] yes yes so the idea is that it's just uh after creating this universe then God enters into it as the South this is my understanding yeah allegorical way the allegorical way we have this idea of the the spider spinning the web and then living inside the web so that it's not that God creates the universe and remains Transcendent after creating the universe he sees imminent in the universe uh has Brahmin brahmana also is upholding this universe in my idea but present in each and every being as the self so one is one is really tint one is really tit and the other is chinmaya created out of his but then so we we have a dream our physical body in that dream we can say it's chinmaya we can say it's a mithya if we want but uh but the I'm I'm not Metea uh I'm really the self I'm really the the sleeper and the dreamer so a little bit different so Taco has both attitudes sometimes you'll say I see everything is is within each and every being that'll be real Consciousness real awareness not that he's saying that the chairs have awareness looking back at me they have no senses to be able to do that but he sees that that's also a form of of a Divine mother we could say itself the vignani point of view I think was still this that distinction will be there that everything is a manifestation agreement but each and every individual is Roman that it's not that that uh when I have a dream and the character and the dream it's not a projection from the sleeper it is it's the same one when I wake up same eye it's the same eye but the others is is really a type of projection so that'll be the the web that spun out of the spider it comes from it but it's separate from it and the spider dwells within it the same spider and forgets itself and that's each and every one of us or that Roman it's very hard to to Really uh comprehend how this is possible but when we analyze and we find that uh everything that that represents our individuality is the superimposition then we're left with said well I I am nothing but the the witness of everything that pure awareness and this is a direct experience had this experience over and over again so when he says I saw a wicked man in front of the Kali Temple but in him also I saw the power of the Divine mother vibrating so not that I'm saying his body was jinmaya now he's saying within him that'll mean that's that's the self-defined mother herself is present there it's a subtle distinction we may think it's it's not a very important distinction but uh to me it's important because even even someone who who doesn't accept someone who likes this dualistic idea Sankey idea say that this is still they can have that feeling that that divine presence is shining within the heart of everyone and see the divine within that that Consciousness that is within each and every person has a Divine source that's why whenever I hear this I don't see them as as uh as as linked I see them as separate doctors that do not necessarily the case that to be an advantage we have to accept both of them we have to accept the first one this is the real meaning that the non-difference between the so-called Jiva and environment the status of these external universe is speculative that we we can't prove it one way or the other Taco said so many times who can understand this about this creation and why it comes and all of that that that's uh so one can can say as takur says that why I call this universe unreal is not mithya in his point of view and yet he can accept the first one that Brahman is the Ultimate Reality and he could accept the fact that this this eye is just a stick on the surface of the water that the real self is is one and perfect and unborn he can accept all of that foreign continues that is why I fed a cat with the food that was to be offered to the Divine mother I clearly perceived that the Divine mother herself had become everything even the cat so she had become everything and she dwelled within the cat that Consciousness the cat has consciousness God is aware of the world we don't know what the thought process process is like but the cat absolutely has Consciousness it can't function without it so that means the Divine mother is present there also I clearly perceive that the Divine mother itself had become everything even the cat the manager of the temple Garden wrote to mathur Babu saying that I was feeding the cat with the offering intended for the Divine mother but butter Babu had insight into the state of my mind this was part of that Divine Play if anybody else had been there he would have been kicked out his behavior was so odd and so eccentric for a Brahmin priest and a temple to do the things that he did even going so far as to slap the Ronnie one time he would have been kicked out instantly this was just we can say divine grace or part of this was there who protected him and he would tell all the other priests don't say a word don't say anything about the Young The Young priest he would say let him do whatever he wants he recognized there's something special about him and because of that Rani rashmoni also recognized it and she gave also that final consent so Mata Babu had insight into the state of my mind he rode back to the manager let him do whatever he likes you must not say anything to him after realizing God one sees all this all right so this this is our problem we're trying to understand these things without having to realize God so we're doing it just to that limited uh intelligence very limited intelligence and understanding that we have and takur is doing it after having the highest realization over and over again so after realizing God one sees all this a right that it is he you know I I always think she is better the Divine mother who has become the universe living beings and the 24 Cosmic principles so the universe that'll be the chinmaya and living beings or the jivas 24 Cosmic principles uh everything that is material substance of this of the parent of this universe but what remains when God completely effaces the ego cannot be described in words now this will be when this jagadismitya because the the common experience of those who are entering into this highest state of samadhi is that this universe seems to disappear before their very own eyes we read this video we hear it in in the words of swamiji and even kashipur that he had no sense of a body he couldn't feel his body or see anything only he felt his face was there and that disappeared and everything so uh the fact the fact that that the experience doesn't mean that that's the metaphysical truth that the universe is unreal at least in the yoga system that they make a strong point that everyone else will still be living in the same universe it'll just be for that person that Universe seems to disappear at that time so this this uh unreality of the universe may be the highest stage of Guyana but talk was teaching uh conviction is that there's something higher which equals vignana when the Mind comes down a little bit then we see this world as real because we know what it is so when we when we talk about the snake in the Rope that if we say the snake is unreal it doesn't mean that there's nothing there it means that we let's under once we know it's really a rope then we can say it's real now we know what it really is so the tacos idea that after realization we know the the reality of the world as it really is not this false not superimposition so after realizing God once he's all this all right that it is he who has become the universe living beings and the 24 Cosmic principles but what remains when God completely effaces the ego cannot be described in words as RAM Prasad said in one of his songs that alone will you know whether you were good or I am good I get into even that state now and then yeah takur when uh they say that after his uh his long stay in nearby that after that his mind had the tendency to keep going back into that nirvikova samadhi state and this close devotees weren't there at that time uh later because of the coming of the devotees and because of his his sincere prayer to the Divine mother not to let him get lost and then he recover samadhi we find that uh it wasn't as common he would go into that bhava samadhi state that where he would feel that joy and ecstasy and communion with Divine mother and everything but this nearby Copeland state was was not so common at the end partly because this prayer to the Divine mother and partly because I he knew that he had a mission to fulfill and he wanted to enjoy the company of the devotees and the joys of bhakti and bhakta the two things that kept kept his mind down he had to really make an effort to keep his mind down and then he makes a beautiful statement a man sees a thing in one way through reasoning and in an altogether different way when God himself shows it to him so we have no choice we we have we use our reasoning and then we also have our faith in uh what top was telling us because this is a direct experience direct experience he said his words go beyond Aveda and vedanta even what's written in the scriptures will get things that he can and and even he'll admit that there are certain things that just can't be explained what did he say back here when God completely faces the ego what what remains then cannot be described in words okay now we get to the next day Monday December 17th so M has already been here several days began 1883. it was about eight o'clock in the morning SRI ramakrishna was in his room with M when Dr madhu arrived and sat down beside the master on the small couch he was an elderly man and full of wit he used to visit the master when the latter felt indisposed sat down beside the master on the small couch see we we have this feeling that sadhu the householder will never sit on the same couch this means the small dead as as a sought to will that this is not proper in anything but taku was so simple and he had no feeling of pride of being even Assad to forget about father hamsa and everything that it was in that natural it is nothing that he would ever possibly think oh how can you sit on the bed with me and everything like that but very sweet the elderly doctor comes in and sits next to him we when we try to picture these things it's a very nice talk we love to have people nearby so he could touch them from time to time that was another trick that he had it just is just a little touch like that that would help help them to understand things he was an elder man elderly man and full of wit he used to visit the master when the latter failed indisposed master the whole thing in a nutshell is that one must develop ecstatic love for sachidananda and now here we have two completely different uh schools of thought sachidananda these the Yannis will love this type of stuff and not much this will be our our Brahman near Guna Brahman and everything maybe even saguna Brahman but this ecstatic love this is this is a personal God this is a god with form attributes is the Avatar and everything for taqwar they're the same he doesn't make that distinction for him the Divine mother is everything she's a Transcendent Brahman she's imminent herself within everything so for him it makes no difference to he can use this type of language which for us may sound odd ecstatic loafers he means is for the Divine for the Divine mother in whatever form she comes what kind of love how should one love God godi used to say then one must become like Sita to understand Rama like bhagavati the Divine mother to understand bhagavan Shiva one must practice austerities as the bhagavati did in order to attain Shiva one must cultivate the attitude of prakriti in order to realize Buddha the attitude of a friend a handmaid or a mother a little background on his goatee these are all interesting characters that we find in the gospel foreign [Music] district and he was they call him veerachari tantric so the worshiper of the Divine mother and he had some special powers we know that he was one of the ones who came to dakshineswar he he met him first in 1856 and uh that was when they uh they had that assembly of all the great pundits there and he uh recognized ramakrishna as in as in Avatar and spend a lot of time with him and uh it says day after day godi became more and more enchanted with this Divine mood of shivami Krishna and he became he became completely devoted to surami Krishna and gradually through the Divine company of Swami Krishna that is intense renunciation came to him and one day uh with tears in his eyes he came to Sri Krishna and took his leave and renounced home forever and even after a great search that no one was able to determine where he went after that but there are many cases where these great pundits and panditsu in India you know they're they're not necessarily grades of spiritual people they're Giant intellects and usually have some good understanding of things but Tucker always said that whenever there was any pundit in town he would send redo or somebody to go check him out if he has no renunciation or discrimination I don't then I don't care to see him if he hasn't some uh modesty and dead renunciation and discriminatory of that and then he wouldn't talk we would go with with the great reverence and uh and and many of these great pundits who were there at that time became so devoted to srama Krishna and became really uh filled with with this longing for God and uh not just him who else was another one who renounced the world and went off to Menards who was it [Music] and the voice of children we know became so devoted this ramakrishna so uh he had that effect on these great pundits because they had the knowledge they just had to to uh transferred from the head to the heart somehow they had that that knowledge so this is gauri Pandit so takor will quote him sometimes uh but all of this he was a great worshiper of the Divine mother so this is why he's emphasizing that go to used to say one must become like Sita to understand Rama like bhagavati the Divine mother to understand the bhagavan Shiva one must practice austerity as bhagavati did in order to attain Shiva one must cultivate the attitude of prakriti that means the female in order to realize Buddha the male principle the attitude of a friend a handmade or a mother now there are two ideas here one emphasizes this idea that uh we have these two aspects male and female this is a very common idea is the whole sanky philosophy uses the terminology they may not talk too much about male and female but the terminology could assuming the male but really means females also so based on a Shiva Shakti there are many schools like that and they generally worship God is the Divine mother but this is the other attitude that we want to worship Shiva then we have to take the attitude of Shakti and this actually is something that is not restricted or limited to uh identifying with the female aspect this is something we find it all about as if we have the dasiabhava then identifying with Hanuman the same same idea in order to worship Rama so uh this is this is what I find to be the very brilliant psychological element to this idea of Bahamas that the uh if we want to worship God in any form we immerse ourselves in the form of the of the Divine of the worshiper that so we want to worship as a young boy we don't fix the mind when Krishna is a young boy we fix the mind on your shoulder so that we can identify with her and feel ourselves to be like the mother of Krishna then we can really worship Krishna so this is this is that uh idea this attitude that godi Pandit had so in order uh in order to understand Rama we must become like Sita that idea then surama Krishna says I saw Sita in a vision I found that her entire mind was concentrated on Rama she was totally indifferent to everything her hands her feet her clothes her Jewels it seemed that Rama had filled every bit of her life and she could not remain alive without Rama this this we talked about before that he saw her walking he saw this was a vision with eyes open that near the panchavati he saw a woman that he had never seen before very elegant uh luminous reform coming to him and then the monkey jumped out of a tree and rolled in front of her and then he realized this was Sita who would come and we know that all everything that he saw the Bangles and he had the same type made for holy mother so that was a very important Vision that's ramakrishna had so generally he would he would do that he would either identify or or even have a vision first and after having the vision of Sita then he could have the experience of Rama it's something like that how it worked in his mind not just in his mind as a whole philosophy behind this idea of the different powers m M yes sir she was mad with love for Rama Master madani he's the man that's the word one must become mad with love in order to realize God but that love is not possible if the Mind dwells on woman in gold now this is what I warned everybody about don't get too excited about all of this that now he's really I don't know what exactly his uh uh his he was trying to uh how he was trying to kind of break M's mind and remold it somehow with a very strong language because this is not the kind of stuff that he talks to in general with the uh the householder deputies he may say after the birth of one or two children even that's for a very Advanced activities but this is this is for him usually I I don't like to translate this comedy conscious woman in Gold but we we have to here there is a sex life with a woman what happiness is there and that the realization of God gives 10 million times more happiness now one other thing is that M already had children he uh he was already entangled he had household problems uh had his child died yet at this point comes later one was to die so anyhow uh he really wanted to warn him without having more and even then it had more children afterwards so this is also part part of that gauri used to say that when a man attends ecstatic love of God all the poorers of the skin even the roots of the hair become like so many sexual organs and in every poor the aspirant enjoys the happiness of communion with the ottoman yeah so uh what what his he was he was a brilliant psychologist why and how he's doing this to M at this point in the midst of their long stay because at the end of the whole thing they'll say and now you're ready to go back in the world and live with wife and children and everything but somehow he's trying to prepare his mind and of course he wants to imprint on his mind that God realization is the ultimate goal of life and that that's more important than anything else one must call on God with a longing heart one must learn from the guru how God can be realized only if the guru himself has attained perfect knowledge can he show the way a man gets rid of all desires when he has perfect knowledge he becomes like a child five years old say just like the tatreya and had the nature of a child now we this is one of our big catch-22s that we can't realize God as long as we have a single desire and we can't get rid of all desires until we realize God so what do we do [Music] we we do our best we try to get rid of uh the big desires the little desires are not a big problem as we get closer and closer than the desires they'll fall away they'll fall away and after God realization what is there to desire we have that which fulfills everything it's not that we're giving up any desire we don't have any more desires we've we've gotten everything that we run m one hears about them these great sages but there were many others like them that the world doesn't hear about master yes the gyani gets rid of all desire if any is left it does not hurt him at the touch of the Philosopher's Stone the sword is transformed into gold then that sword cannot do any killing just so the gyani keeps on the assemblance of anger and passion sometimes Tucker uses this illustration for this the ego is for this ripe ego they are anger and passion only in name and cannot injure him because uh the the god-release so still has a human mind it's transformed by the old some Scholars are there uh God realized Soul can still feel hunger and thirst the physical body is still there and everything but these are not the real desires that entangle us and in Sharma Christian's case he had to keep some desires just to keep the Mind down a little bit and yes sir the gyani goes beyond the three gunas as you say he is not under the control of any of the gunas or Thomas all these three are so many robbers as it were sure so m is is uh referring to Islamic Christian story of of the Three Robbers who uh one wants to kill the other one's the bind and the other helps liberate Master yes one must assimilate that so I am learning from Christiano oh I remember that story you told and the surrounded Christian is saying okay it's okay you remember it but it's one thing just to refer to it you have to really understand it so what does it mean to really understand it it means that uh these these passions and desires really can kill us they can destroy our lives or they can just keep us bound and even the ones that can help us have to be left behind even it has to be left behind but that helps us that takes us out of the forest that shows us the way so we have to cultivate that and then at the very end m in this world there are perhaps not more than three or four men of perfect knowledge that's interesting because I'm just said there were many others like them that the world doesn't hear about now he's saying three or four it probably means that at the present time Master why do you say that one sees many holy men and sannyasis in the monasteries of upper India so this is when the uh before they had all the different names for all the states and everything what was the upper provinces they would talk about so Banaras in those places Taco head of course he went to menares he he had visits from sadhus from rishikesh he knew about these places and of course from Punjab and there wasn't much of a tradition of of sannyasis in Bengal at that time it was mostly these white augis from the devotion of a tradition but the actual shankaracharya tradition it wasn't wasn't very strong or well known uh in Bengal so most of the sadhus see when when Tucker was young when he was in the commercial Court that somehow I don't know exactly how but they say that uh the village of kamarpakor was One path that suthers would take on their way to Puri so the law of family had a place where the soldiers could take food and rest and stay and everything so takur spent a lot of time with them and most of them were from North India most of them would be Hindi speakers probably and which is probably house ramakrishna learned Hindi he could he could understand Hindi speak some Hindi also so Master why do you say that one sees many holy men and sannyasis in the monasteries of upper India M well I too can become a sannyasi like one of those now he's not said he's this is a little sarcastic he's not he's not saying I can also be a sanyasi what he's saying is that what do they do they're lazy people they put on some cloth they Wonder from Facebook it's we we get that impression a little bit that um is a little bit skeptical about that the master fixed his Gaze on M but the talker doesn't take it exactly that way and said by renouncing everything so now he's saying okay you're making fun of them but can you renounce everything you're you're talking about them about you M now see M's mind is still going back and forth back and forth mental pronunciation real renunciation so he says what can a man achieve this is him unless he gets rid of Maya what will a man gain by merely being a sannyasi if he cannot subdue Maya so now he's saying this sannyasis that just by taking sonyasa just by putting the ocher cloth and everything then if they still have Maya Maya here means attachment it means attachment of course based on the ignorance but but really if they cannot attachment and desires both remain silent in a few minutes so there's this whole thing is sinking in Taco is letting it sink into M's head and let him really think what does it mean to renounce m sir then the topic changes a little bit what is the nature of the Divine love transcending the three gunas master attaining that love the devotee sees everything full of spirit and Consciousness again chin Maya again so this uh when they're talking about the Divine love transcending the three going this first ceramic Christian this is also the vigyan estate the United States it's not simply after nearby samati it can be also after bhava and Prema after a very high states of that will also give realization and after that then the the bhakta will see everything that way the the gyani may see things differently this is what Tupper says that the Yani keeps the the the ego of knowledge they for them everything may be a dream like they may they may be immersed in the self always mind going up and everything but for the devotee someone who who has this Divine love transcending the three gunas they'll see they'll see the face of God every word face with the Beloved everywhere wherever they look okay so the the Radha and the gopis everything they saw Krishna Maya they saw Krishna wherever they looked at that of course some type of Association that uh wherever they whatever they saw there was some Divine connection ology they would remind Krishna of his dark complexion so attaining that love the deputy sees everything full of spirit spirit and Consciousness to him krishna's Consciousness and the sacred Abode is consciousness again this is uh secretary voters Consciousness the devotee two is consciousness everything is consciousness very few people attain such love now srama Krishna he used to say that very few can attain to this nearby copper samati very highest state to savati same way he said very few can attended very high states of of devotion this is prima that it'll the force of the Ecstasy will shatter the body even it'll be so great that it has to be a huge other huge container someone with a tremendous spiritual power to be able to withstand the force of that tremendous feeling of divine love ecstatic love probably his jaw is dropping listening to all of this really is he's talking to him but Dr mother is still there probably still sitting next to him on the couch the love transcending the three gunas means in other words that the devotee is not under the control of any of the gunas Master smartthing yes that's it he becomes like a child at five years old not under the control of any of the gunas okay oh there's just a little bit more to the end of the chapter the master was resting after his noon meal money Malik arrived and saluted him money Malik was a Elder ramazzott member of the Brahma Savage and uh he also he came to this ramakrishna suffering from the loss of the son he was filled with grief and these these fellow Taco was the only one who could relieve him of that grief so he became very devoted to srama Krishna uh Manny Malik arrived and saluted him SRI Rama Krishna remained lying on the couch and said a word or two to money money I hear you visited keshav Sen Master yes how was he now we saw that when he was very ill and he could hardly get up he could only get a walk around by holding on to the to the walls and everything he was so weak uh money he hasn't recovered to any extent from his illness in fact he'll die very shortly master I found him to be very Roger seek now why will takur is he is he criticizing him I think this is a bit of abhiman that he's not that he was Roger sick but why did he make me wait I wanted to see him I loved him so much I had to sit for such a long time he said I found it very ragic I had to wait a long time before I could see him I don't think because he loved it he knew that he had a little bit of rudges that's that's all but he also found that he was talking to the Divine mother at the end and he was a completely transformed person the ketchup and a great love for him so we shouldn't take this as as a very demeaning type of statement the master sat up on the couch and continued his conversation with the devotees master to it to him I became mad for Rama I used to walk about carrying an image of ramlala the the little smaller brass image of the baby Rama given to me by a monk I bathed it fed it and laid it on the sleeve I carried it wherever I went I became mad for ramlala that's another instance of something that uh is very very difficult for us to comprehend what exactly how astronomic Christian is seeing this this brass image saw the real baby from and spoke to it and uh washed it and bathed it and fitted and everything it's uh this is all all that uh mind of the ecstatic mistake that is is different from our mind or the Avatar we can say I don't know otherwise very hard to explain okay that's the end of that chapter we'll continue Emma dakshineswar part one it's a new chapter but it's actually the same it's the and still Evan's visit I'm not sure why it's exactly it's uh different anyhow um [Music] foreign foreign [Music] who was stainless of infinite nature whose heart melts and sympathy for his devotees who is an embodiment of the Divine and the Supreme Lord and ever worthy of our worship peace peace peace Beyond