Video 50

50. Bhagavad Gita I Chapter 4 Verse 19 I Swami Sarvapriyananda

[Music] [Music] so we are studying the fourth chapter of the bhagavad-gita and we last time we did a very very important verse a paradoxical language but very crucial verse the verse was the 18th verse of the fourth chapter you'll remember uh karmandi akarma what does it mean the one who sees action in action in the midst of action an action where there is apparently no action such a person is wise among human beings such a person is the true yogi and such a person is the doer of all actions very paradoxical language what is the indicating what he's showing is that the enlightened person who realizes that i am brahmana i am this pure being existence consciousness bliss and um beyond all activities activities are at the level of the body and at the level of the mind in the witness consciousness the consciousness which which illumines all activities there is no change there there is no activity that's forever beyond that so i as this witness consciousness i do not act even when i am working through the body and mind even when i'm maybe thinking and talking walking eating interacting with people i do not do anything and that's something that an enlightened person can honestly say maybe they don't say it but they can honestly say to themselves it's clear to them so this enlightened person even when this enlightened person is acting it is doing work he says there is no work there is no activity going on there is no action i am not involved in this though apparently from uh from our perspective fully involved who is more active than krishna but krishna is saying here from my perspective if you ask me honestly if you ask are you not driving the chariot are you not you know doing all this action help talking about the gita giving the gita advice to arjuna he will say yes truly are you doing that no actually not because from the point of view of it's like the the the screen on which the movie is playing is there a lot of activity going on a lot of action going on there comedy tragedy yes truly so no truly it's just a screen and light and sound so the enlightened person sees there is no action in the midst of intense action swamiji said that from that perspective there is eternal calm in the midst of intense activity and where there is absolute quietness outside you don't fall asleep one can be internally we're also very very active but from the perspective of the atman from the perspective of reality you are beyond activity beyond beyond karma beyond cause and effect that's what it means and the wise person also sees the enlightened person also sees in the so-called apparent inactivity of the unwise the person who thinks i will not get involved in samsara i'm going to run away and sit in a mountain cave and meditate and there i will get peace in that also the enlightened person sees there is activity there that's uh there is agent ship a person is deciding to do not this but that and you still caught is most important you are still caught in the cycle of karma you still got in the cycle of karma there is no escape for such a person that is not the way out swami vikander said you cannot run away from the machine you have to learn how to work the machine machine means samsara maya you have to learn how to work the machine and the machine will set you free right so this is what the enlightened person sees and this is why it's called sub buddhiman such a person is enlightened remember it's a strange thing normally what would you say if you see a thing as it is if you see the thing as it is you are you are wise if you see something as it is not how can you be wise so if you see action as action and in action as in action involvement as involvement and detachment as detachment then you are wise krishna is seemingly saying just the opposite here so this is you have to have the the advaithic perspective the perspective of the witness consciousness from the perspective this now he is not speaking from the perspective of body mind he is not speaking from the perspective of a person he's speaking from the perspective of reality as being as awareness so this is real wisdom so yukta such a person is truly centered in the atman truly centered in the truth established in the truth so yukta means a true yogi and and krishna karma a very interesting phrase the doer of all actions why do people do actions people do actions for fulfillment people are involved in the world you study and you work out and you get married and children have a job pursue a career try to get people to you know get the praise of people um achieve things in life all of it a great deal of activity for what for fulfillment now the tragedy is that activity cannot lead to fulfillment it has its place fulfillment comes from god realization fulfillment comes from enlightenment from knowing the infinitude after self this person has realized that having realized that one can say then this person the enlightened one has truly accomplished the purpose of all actions purpose of all actions fulfillment this person fulfilled not by actions by enlightenment so you can say what all people in the world what they are trying to get by all these activities this person has got it hence this person is the doer of all actions in the sense of having got the ultimate goal or purpose of all action so that is the background now what krishna is going to do is from the 19th verse up to the 24th this section itself it shows um advaita in in action the manifestation of advaithic knowledge once you become enlightened how do you live life in second chapter he introduced us to advaithic knowledge the realization and shiva my divine nature how do you realize that you are the atman that was introduced in the second chapter third chapter he talked about karma yoga but karma yoga has a method to purify and get ready for enlightenment but now he's bringing all of that together how after enlightenment one can live one's life one can act in the world that that's very important these are the two important questions in our life what spirituality promises god realization enlightenment how do i do that how do i get it that's one second how do i live my life i still have my life to lead the world is there my body is dead i'm living so what what guidance do i have for living my life both of these are combined in this section verse 18 onwards it will come to a grand climax in verse 24. now going ahead verse number 19. all of these are very beautiful verses and full of spiritual insight the way we can live our lives we also we don't have to wait for enlightenment what the the insights which are given here we can put it to use in our life to the extent that we can yes yes [Music] he whose actions are all free from hankering for desires whose actions have been burned by the fire of knowledge him the wise call a sage 19th verse so what does this mean here the question is will the enlighten after enlightenment once you have this realization will you at all interact with the world will you at or will you sit on top of a mountain or in an ashram will you at all do anything in this world um one second or not and the answer in no uncertain terms is given in this verse yes you will active samara activity life can be full of activities for the enlightened person but where is the difference and why the question is why would an enlightened person act how would he act which is different from all of the activity of everybody else and why at all what's the motivation for an enlightened person to act and where does this motivation come from how is this motivation different from the motivation of the rest of us who act for other purposes so for that we have to see this term is there kama sankalpa virgita devoid of hankering beyond the hankering for fulfillment of desires see why do most people act from a vedantic perspective action is where does this come from by action i mean everything that we do in life consciously deliberately whatever we do in life vedanta says it all comes from desire kaama kaama means desire desire for fulfillment i am unfulfilled and i want fulfillment and therefore whatever i think will fulfill me beyond even the biological needs and i need food and shelter fine but beyond that i need company i need uh education i need money i need everything else that society tells me you know the society uh is constantly bombarding us with things you need this to get a smiley face right so um karma comes uh because i feel i need fulfillment but why do i feel that i need fulfillment somewhere there's a deep feeling that i am unfulfilled i am limited and this comes from avidya ignorance ignorance of my ever fulfilled nature i do not know that i am the atman i do not know my inner spiritual nature and therefore not knowing it not knowing that i'm sachidan under the infinite unlimited existence consciousness i that is hidden from me and then i become identified with a mind and a body the moment i am identified with the mind and the body i'm stuck i'm trapped in samsara because the mind and body by themselves are limited there's no doubt this body it's just so dependent on food on i mean little bit of bad health in this body little bit of pain it immediately affects the mind the mind itself so dependent on the praise of others on the good behavior of others on the fulfillment of so many desires so moment i am identified with body and mind i will become limited and i will be open to feelings of being not fulfilled not satisfied and therefore desire will come calm and then i will work to fulfill those desires working to fulfill desires karma coming from desires kaaba coming from avidya remember this phrase shankaracharya is fond of it avid karma ignorance desire action ignorance desire action so avidya kama karma you'll see what's wrong with it so if you are if you are in action in activity but strong then you are trapped in the cycle of samsara action will lead to consequence karma will lead to karma results of karma and then that cycle goes on repeating itself and then beyond this lifetime also it will push us into other lives other bodies other experiences so on so to come out of this cycle you need enlightenment but the question is after enlightenment will this person act will this person be engaged um the answer given in no uncertain terms by krishna is certainly certainly samara activity can go on the enlightened person's life apparently can be full full of activity of course we remember that enlightened person will say i don't i do nothing in the midst of all activities he will say i see no activity at all no karma i'm not trapped in karma i am the reality and the movie scream so what comedy or what tragedy and beyond all of it and yet all of it can go on how will it be different the difference will be this the enlightened person not having ignorance will not have sense of lack of fulfillment and will not have desires coming from lack of fulfillment and will not act out for to fulfill those desires so the enlightened person acts from contentment we act from discontent the enlightened person acts from peace and unshakable peace we act out of disturbance because we don't have peace that's why we are acting trying to regain the lost equilibrium enlightened person is ever inequally pray the enlightened person acts out of satisfaction we act out of dissatisfaction we we are in karma are we trying to fulfill desires enlightened person just has no desires to fulfill so this is the difference then you will say still the question remains what is the motivation then why what motivation remains for an enlightened person i understand my motivation there are certain things i want in to-do list a to-do list so people get white board one two three four you'll write down and then to write things in the white do word also becomes one more thing to do so in the to-do list what to do and then i'm acting out of that the enlightened person does not have that then why should the enlightened person act at all the answer is the enlightened person acts out of what is called loka sangra desire for the welfare of the world krishna has said that acts out of compassion acts out of love acts out of concern for others acts out of a sense of giving not forgetting something from others so to give not not forgetting not for trying to get fulfillment already fulfilled tries to fulfill others so this is the reason that an enlightened person acts but then where does this motivation come from where does this love come from where does this desire to help others where does this come or isn't it another desire no the source is then the enlightenment itself this enlightened being now knows that he or she is one with everybody there is one consciousness and i am that in all those bodies i am the one as i feel hungry and i try to feed this body so also i should try to satisfy the hunger of others as i am hurt and i need relief from pain in this body so also i try to help and take care of others i know it is me i shine forth in all of those beings it is the same divinity they know it not and the enlightened being knows it that's the only difference and knowing it from that comes compassion it can come if you are devotional it will not be compassion it could be devotion so ramakrishna said who are you to show compassion it is shiva gyani jivaseva knowing the divinity is present in all these beings no matter what mask they're putting on friend enemy indifferent to me good or bad whatever it is the same divinity is behind everybody and then will you show compassion to god no it will be worship of god so you worship the god in the temple with flowers and incense and chanting you worship the god in the classroom through chalk and talk and blackboard and lectures you worship the god in the hospital through medicine and nursing and so on so it comes out of that feeling of oneness with everybody in fact all ethics it's a big topic all ethics comes from that why should i do good to others that's why wakanda says why should i not cut the throat of my neighbor if it is to my advantage why should i love my neighbor where is the justification for that the justification is in this advaithic realization so therefore this enlightened person acts how is the motivation different from us see this is what swan vivekananda called the manifestation of the divinity building after having realized the divinity within i am brahmana then it is to be manifested in my thinking in my words and mostly in my activity so my activity will now become save our service three points here i mean three kinds of manifestation of this the enlightened person can act and that action can be of two kinds the action is so the first option is the enlightened person after enlightenment keeps on doing what he or she has been doing earlier just the role in your society you are a husband or a wife or a mother or father you have you're a corporate executive or like arjuna warrior in the battlefield you go on doing your duty as an enlightened person due to me in the sense that this is the natural place of this body mind i am not this body mind what does this body mind have to do you do the once you know that you are the actor in a play knowing that you're an actor in the play what will you do will you start now you realize i am not the um you know i'm not a beggar i'd rather be the emperor so will the actor immediately change the script and try to start pretending as them but he'll just ruin the clip if you say i am an actor i am not bound by the limitation of the role you have given me we tell the director i will give whatever dialogue i like i will play i will act the way i like i free because it's not real for me then you will simply ruin the play so the enlightened being plays the part which you are you know the enlightened person has been set into continues to play that surrounding krishna gave a cute example he said uh a clerk had been put in jail for some reason now he's set free and then he says will he dance around like a madman after being set free from jail no no he'll go back to being a clerk he'll he'll keep on doing in bengali it makes it has more punch all right jail canada the enlightened being will go back to doing to do what he he or she was doing so in our scriptures and texts ancient texts you have um you have descriptions of housewives who are enlightened after being enlightened will does the person say okay i'm not going to cook anymore i'm i'm enlightened now i'm going to go around giving without the talks no they were happy enough to do exactly what they were doing earlier and yet it's nothing to them there are kings emperors who became enlightened janaka for example and others also so did they say that i am enlightened now this is not for me i'm going to go to an ashram no i like that story about nisargadatta maharaja a modern enlightened person in mumbai who lived in a slum after his enlightenment experience he set out for the himalayas apparently i was reading that and then he felt what am i doing so what is it exactly the time sits uh searching on mountain top which is not in that terrible slum in mumbai it's the same ramen everywhere the difference is only name and form why am i seeking peace in the mountains i should be able to find it right here and so he went came back to that slum and yes he sold billies you know there was like cigarettes but much worse than cigarettes so and he kept on doing that till the very end of his life and all people who went to him for enlightenment they had to go to that slum and say search him out and sit in that place for to anyway so the question is so the point is the person make one option is continue to do what they were doing or the second option may actually do something different so when swami vivekananda talks about karma yoga for you know massive action for the upliftment of the poor for serving the sick you know action social action you can do a lot of good to the world and often an enlightened person or they might go out and teach that's another thing that enlightened people share they want people to have the same realization that's a big motivation so they do that um so notice karma yoga sri krishna in the bhagavad-gita and swami vivekananda same karma yoga but there's a different flavor to it shri krishna says to arjuna what you are going to do fight this war do the same thing but now as karma yoga swami vivekananda says that your monks are lay people but now engage in activity for the welfare of the world so he's not saying that your own existing duty new thing he's saying take it up this new great field of action for the welfare of humanity engage yourself spend this life in as a sacrifice to the welfare of the virat of this divinity all around you you see the slight difference in the two kinds of karma yoga both are perfectly alright so these are the two options there's a third option the enlightened person can actually withdraw from karma also can become one of those traditional wandering monks don't think that if they do not do any karma they are not enlightened certainly they can be fully enlightened you can sit like rama ramashi completely absorbed in in brahman can wander around like torta pudi sudama krishna's guru are they not enlightened of course they are so all three are possible do they act yes and two kinds of action just doing what they were doing earlier maybe you will not even recognize them or doing some extraordinary action teaching social action uplift of people and so on big thing you will recognize them as very magnificent people indeed or third they will know they will not act they will that means they will not be engaged in the usual activity whereas the ordinary motives for action are one people act for worldly fulfilling worldly desires two they act for fulfilling other worldly desires so what are their wealthy desires we don't generally don't have them now because as one senior monk told us because the modern people don't believe in other words don't believe in heaven or anything like that but that heaven was a thing that the ancient vedic people not only vedic buddhists jains so they believed in multiple heavens a much better place than this and if you are a good person and you get a lot of what is called punya merit do meritorious action religious rituals like the vedic sacrifices you get to go to one of these higher heavens after that again temporary when the results of action run out you come back again to this word so that's an otherworldly desire it's still worldly you see the worldly word is there it's still worthy so people act for that or if they are spiritual like all the people here we say we don't want to satisfy we don't we are not interested in worldly desires not even otherworldly desires so for vedanta you must have this is called then why do you act why do you come to class why do you read books why do you meditate why do you do japa why do you serve people where do you try to change yourself be a better person a lot of practice is going on here why so this is for workshop for enlightenment for god realization for liberation that's what we are all trying to do enlightened persons actions for none of this they are a different class altogether they are not doing it for the satisfaction of worldly desires they have none they are not doing it for satisfaction of other worldly desires they are not interested in going to heaven they are not even doing it for moksha because they already have it shankaracharya sings i am not doing it for satisfaction of you know for getting pleasure i am not doing i am not i do not want um wealth i do not even want um you know to do good actions to get merits so that i can go to heaven after death no i do not even want um enlightenment and liberation no moksha why because he's already already liberated and then what are you chidan and shivoham i'm of the nature of consciousness bliss i am shiva i am shiva so this is the difference between the activity or non-activity of the enlightened person compared to the rest of us rest of us includes people who are worldly goats people who have other worldly goals and people who have spiritual goals a sadaqa spiritual seeker still is a person who has a goal remember we all have a we have to be very careful about it we may not have when we say we do karma yoga unselfish action unselfish in the sense that we do not have selfish worldly goals or otherworldly goals but we have the goal of enlightenment which is a wonderful thing but we have it until one is enlightened one should not say that i have nothing to do in this world we have okay now let us look at the words quickly so who all of those activities which means surveys so there is a plenty of activity going on there so the enlightened person is acting is devoid of desire and the sankalpa the determination the cognitions behind desire so what are these that means the idea this is good this is nice i could use some of that i could use some more money i could use some of these gadgets i could use a new car i could i could use a kovid vaccine you know and so stuff like that and so that is the thing that this is good i need it the moment we have that is called sankalpa what happens it gives rise it sprouts as desire i want and then i go out and get it you can't stop it after that it will come in thought and speech and activity kama sankalpa varjita the enlightened person is devoid of all of these but remember not divide of all motivation there is the motivation of doing good to work to the world which we just described we talked about which is an expression of the realization itself manifestation the divinity itself that's that's their motivation not like this all the actions of the enlightened person so if they're doing actions won't they generate results so one there'll be new uh actions and so won't it continue for them no it won't first of all the enlightenment brahma gyana it is supposed to destroy all accumulated karma suramar krishna put it this way he says suppose there's a mountain of cotton and you take someone takes a matchstick and throws it lights it and throws it into this mountain of cotton what will happen no matter how huge is this mountain of cotton it's going to burn up in a trace just go it will just go up in a blaze immediately knowledge is like that no matter all our good and bad karma stored up in past life we have no idea of it but once you realize you are not the body and mind you are brahman all that is destroyed it's gone it will not give rise results later on what about activities now right now you are saying that the enlightened person engages in lots of activities won't that generate new karma maybe good karma but still new karma no because the enlightened person has no sense of agency the i is still there but the enlightened person knows i am not the i what kind of crazy talk is that not me i'm quoting shankaracharya what is the meaning of that i am not the mind i am not the memory i am not the intellect i am not the ego notice i am not the ego what does that mean i am not i i means the ego without that ego prompted action there is nowhere that you know maya can peg tag you with the karma karma is generated to whom will mahad attach over to to what account will maya put that karma there's no account all accounts closed swami bhutah sanji put this so beautifully one day we were asking i i was there but uh senior monk was asking i was just a novice subutai shanji was the 12th president of our order and i believe at least most of us believe that he was an indictment so somebody were trying to get an idea of what it is like from his perspective so the monk was asking but we see an enlightened person walks and talks and um you know just like the rest of us it eats and recognizes people and all of that all activities go on he said and he would speak with this slow drawl he said that's what you see and then this monk cast exactly that's what we want to know swami what does the enlightened one see what does it feel like from the inside what does the enlightened one see and his answer was who sees who sees i'm not going to explain that you can understand it's not like there's another person in there like a limited person like us so who sees in bengali he said k that so it is like the seeds being roasted in fire so after roasting seeds in fire they'll still look like the same seeds but they will not sprout if you plant them they will not sprout similarly it looks like karma and looks like all the results of karma are there but they will not sprout into new lives new bodies and you know continuation of the cycle of birth and it will not give rise to that of course i've read other accounts other theories one theory interesting theory is no karma always has to give results you can't say that it will not give results so it will not give results to that person maybe but once the work has been done it will set in motion karma the wheel of karma will still rotate now those results have to be given to somebody and so there's a very interesting you know like a implication about this karma theory if there's an enlightened person all the activities of the enlightened person all the good activities which are mostly good activities of course all the punya the merit will go to the those who honor this enlightened person those who serve this enlightened person the disciples whom he blesses um so it is it goes it goes all the way back to the upanishads those who want prosperity in this world those who want things in this world worldly desires you know what's the quickest way to get them go and serve and enlighten being of course you have to get hold of an enlightened being first do something something for an enlightened being your desires will be fulfilled it's it's uh guaranteed worldly desires why how does that happen is that the enlightened being going and fulfilling your desires not at all you probably would not want your desires those worldly desires to be fulfilled but it will still be fulfilled because of all the enormous merit generated by this enlightened being which will give rise to the fulfillment of desires for those who serve or you know honor this person um so this is a common idea in india in the villages even till today so they don't know who's enlightened so if a monk comes along they're very eager to serve but there's an hidden motive there that our desires will be fulfilled so this is um this story you know in the himalayas so a monk comes along and begs and this lady of the house is giving food to that monk and the man of the house is not happy with this is why are you why do you give food to these uh you know these useless wandering beggars and he says see by the grace of the enlightened one our desires we will have a happy life so then this husband says how do you know this guy's enlightened just looks like a how do you know any one of them is enlightened they could just be wandering beggars and unfazed the lady says in that case next life this person will come back and work as our bullock in our fields if it's not enlightened and still easy there's no free lunch there's no free lunches so so she is perfectly honest i've got the better end of the bargain either we are going to get good karma of the enlightened being the blessings of this enlightened one or if he's a useless guy then he's going to come back in the next life and we'll put him to work in our fields as a bullock um yeah so there are many such stories i remember once i was going in a train uh with in india with another monk i was an obvious and white dress but the monk was of course an orange dress and this gentleman who was from a village like a rustic kind of gentleman who was sitting in the seat in front of us so he started a tirade against monks while seeing that monk kept on grumbling and criticizing and so the swami kept quiet i was getting very annoyed but the swami kept quiet after some time when it came time for that gentleman to get down the traditional gentleman with the dhoti and the kutta and all suddenly he was overcome with remorse he got up suddenly and he folded his hands and he went to the swami and he said please forgive me for saying all those things why this fear there's a fear because the downside of this theory that the enlightened ones good karma will help the one who serves those who dishonor or disobey or you know like harm the enlightened one in any way or try to harm all the bad karma whatever is there will will come upon this person so you have to be careful yeah though it's not related i'm reminded of the story of sriram krishna and the holy mother i think he told rider probably who who was misbehaving with him and he told him that do whatever you will to this one to himself i don't mind but be careful of the one who lives in the naha but that means the holy mother who is the most timid and shy woman and she said be careful of that one if that one the one who is within her if that one he says brahma vishnu maheshwara we won't be able to help you the gods of the universe also cannot help you that one even in the slightest bit if the slightest is you know unhappiness you cause to that one so that is shakti so there you have to be very careful of course that's not related to what we are talking about so it's like a burnt um seed suramar krishna gave another example of a burnt rope so a rope which is burnt it has the outline of a rope it looks like a rope maybe a little blacker than usual but it can't tie anybody if you blow up on it it will fly away into ashes so similarly karma which is seen as a rope to bind people by means to cause an effect causality you can't escape that's why i can't just say good good bad bad and none escape the law so you cannot escape but if that law that rope is a burnt rope rope burned by the fire of knowledge it can't bind you it can't bind the enlightened person those who know understand the purpose of this of the texts of the scriptures they call sacha one who is this one jivan mukta maha purusha they're enlightened living while free by living such a person is called pandit that's very interesting the word pandit of course has come into english now now there are wall street pundits and political pundits generally are always wrong in predicting either the wall street or these days elections and results also so but pandit generally it has come from a sanskrit word it means traditionally it means a scholar pandit is a scholar often referred to often brahmin scholars are called pundits um in spirituality in vedanta it has a deeper meaning panda means you know even the word panda those are from india you know it it refers to a temple priest so in orissa in the lingaraj temple or the temple of jagannath the pandas are they generally have a bad reputation they have a reputation of being money grubbing they always out for a handout they will try to get money from you for doing this puja or that worship or something but that's not the original meaning of panda panda means a very beautiful definition of what a pandit really is very vedantic definition so this is a rare commentary on the bhagavad gita by a swami called shankaranandaji it's a very it's about 4 500 years old it's a very non-dualistic commentary it was written you can easily see it was written just for monks a hindi translation exists but english translation is not there yet so here he gives a very beautiful definition of pandit he says so the one who has that flash of enlightenment what flash of enlight enlightenment in every experience that person sees brahman and brahman only this enlightenment this final ultimate realization is called panda the one who has it is a pundit so that's a far cry from our modern pundits a pundit is an enlightened person a fully enlightened person such a person you know all of whose actions arise without any promptings of desire the results of all of those actions are burnt by the fires of knowledge such a person the wise not the rest with ordinary people won't recognize such a person but the wise they recognize and they call this person a pundit this has also a reference to sri krishnas you know when he starts teaching the gita to to arjuna second chapter eleventh verse the second chapter eleventh verse krishna says he says o arjuna you are speaking like a pundit but you you speak wise words but a true pandit will not speak the way you are speaking so that's that's how the bhagavad gita starts now he shows what a true pandit is so that was in the second chapter the beginning of second job eleventh verse the first words that krishna uttered you know so now he says what is a true pundit an enlightened person enlightened being okay before i go on to the next verse just quickly see what's going on in the chat so bill is asking um is the a in ananda a negation like the air himself no no no ananda this is a means ah complete joy this is not a negation of john and in ananda it is that means complete joy it's not a negation when one realizes oneself as the witness consciousness does one at that point experience cosmic consciousness um experience cosmic consciousness that one has to be careful about dealing with that phrase one does realize the final realization would be i am that there is that one consciousness in all beings and i am that that's the realization amram asked me if you want to call that cosmic consciousness yes it is true but what i guess what you mean is does that person feel experienced through everybody's eyes experience through you know like sees through everybody's eyes hears through everybody sees what's in the minds of everybody does that happen no no no that experience is left only to god god alone that is called omniscience and god alone is omniscient so how is that different from an ordinary enlightened being an ordinary ordinary within courts and no enlightened being is ordinary it knows that he or she is the absolute reality beyond god individual and cosmos so i am the absolute that is the realization of an enlightened being not i am god uh girish is asking can an enlightened person direct the waking dream no it is affect the natural course of the empirical world no not as a matter of of course but um some can this is why it creates confusion um so many of the enlightened persons are blessed with extraordinary powers what you might call them supernatural powers but there's nothing supernatural they're just natural powers which we don't know them that they do exist so some of them have it to an extraordinary degree sometimes they'll attain enlightenment through the practice of either yoga or tantra in both ways one gets these powers um that way if you're looking for powers advaita vedanta is a sort of you know is a kind of powerless dull way of becoming enlightened it's it's like somebody compared it to a rocket it takes you straight to the goal and deposits you there but then you missed miss the scenic route so the scenic route is the path of yoga or tantra for example and they do develop several extraordinary powers again every spiritual master warns you against these powers so some of them may have the power of changing certain things in their proximity the sort of sort of directing the course of events in the waking state so that is to be should not confuse that with enlightenment enlightened person just knows the waking dreaming and deep sleep are appearances in the one consciousness which i am all right happy diwali to everybody and then what else is there does karma yoga also mean saying yes to every everything asked for why karma yoga means that you do not ask for everything you do not ask for anything at all so i can add some context to that question yes so basically you are i've been explaining in your talks that you know we have to be unselfish yes so i just wanted to know that where do you draw a line or a boundary of being unselfish because the moment you go on a journey to become unselfish yes the first thing is that you're asked to do many things and everything you want to do you can summaries to god yes everything you want to do for god yes so when unselfishness comes there you might be asked to do many many things like many many people let's say for example i'm going on the road no no no unselfishness does not mean becoming totally aimless and at the mercy of anybody oh here comes an unselfish karma yoga let me put him to work no yeah common sense is always there so you would that's why i said the two kinds of uh activities one might be you just go on doing what you are doing you're a student you're you're a householder you're a monk whatever is there in your situation in life you go on doing that nothing more nothing less or you might embark on some new project out of it which comes naturally to you in every case it is um always there's this common sense i mean it's a good thing always to look at people you would consider to be enlightened or great karma yogis watch their lives there's nothing crazy there they're actually much more sane than most of us then abhijit is asking us [Music] you cannot remove desire without sankalpa so one tries to overcome sankalpas sankalpa means thinking that these things will fulfill me realize that nothing in the world will fulfill me and my whole time and energy is now dedicated to god realization and also whatever action that has to that comes my way if you have a household to take care of you do that that also is converted into spiritual practice so it becomes focused that way no other sankalpa rises or even if it arises that's that's part of the spiritual practice why would a sankalpa rise at all it comes from my past conditioning there are desires in the mind we have not become enlightened yet we are not perfect so desires will keep arising and the time the whole effort is to overcome them to go beyond that to convince oneself that they have not provided deep satisfaction to me so many years not to anybody else so hence yeah then is there somebody asking a question all right um giant dimitri yes uh could you tell me if my kind of if i'm understanding it in the right way so at the end of it it's actually the true self like the the brahman that grants the enlightenment no matter of my jiva and my ego trying to make efforts it's it's all good but at the end it's kind of the brahman who grants uh the inline enlightenment would it be correct to think that kind of my desires for god my desires for vedanta for self-improvement or doing good to the to the world is essentially driven by the plan of the brahmana to realize uh itself in this world and therefore like my eagle really doesn't control anything i am observing the game that is played by the brand through my jiva and when enlightenment will be happening it will happen and all i am left to do is actually sort of watch nothing else all right now let me ask you this question did you notice what jesus said brahman my ego and i three things you mentioned what are you the witness if you are the witness of the eye the ego then you are not the ego no you're not the ego now what vedanta says is very good explore the nature of this witness forget brahman for a while explore the nature of this witness what is this witness so if you are not the eye the eye is appearing to you i means the ego and so is the mind thoughts and feelings and emotions all of them appear to you body appears to you yeah you experience it notice that um you are common to all the thoughts and stages of the body mind you know they come and go in your light you do not come and go um with them so you the light which observes all of this it has to be a kind of light light i don't mean a physical light it has to be kind of awareness that awareness is not limited by any of those thoughts it did not come with those thoughts it does not go away with those thoughts it is not stuck to control it does not control them either yeah it does not control them either it's the ego which tries to control them and fails so you observe the ego you observe the thoughts and perceptions you observe the attempts at controlling and failure to control them sometimes success of controlling them all of them observe in the sense that in your life it's all revealed these things do not limit you the light you are not cut up limited by them you don't begin with them you don't end with them the joy of the ability to control something the joy of progress in spiritual life that is also revealed by you the frustration of not being able to control anything the curiosity of whether i can control or not that is also revealed by you you are not revealed by them they are revealed by you right they are not only revealed by you they are revealed in you the light in you the consciousness you have no proof of them existing outside and at least thoughts do not exist outside awareness so they do not exist outside you other than you they do not exist suppose you the like you are not there see if a particular thought was not there would you still be there yes you would be their witness of all other thoughts if a particular organ did not function i can't see anymore am i still there yes i am the awareness which sees that is aware of not being able to see is aware of still hearing still thinking still speaking but that awareness if that is not there what would remain in this field of experience use the awareness if you are not there if you you suppose if it were possible it's not possible suppose somehow there's an off switch and a switch off this awareness which you're calling yourself this witness blank would the ego still be there would thoughts still be there would awareness go nothing what would go on what would be like yeah nothing nothing blank it would just be erased you know even the mind will say no no others would go on but others are that's just the thought in the mind and that mind itself would be raised it would just blank it would disappear into darkness see the whole panorama is not only revealed to you the witness who are not limited by anything in that panorama it's revealed in you the witness and it has no existence apart from you the witness yes this unlimited nature of the witness which you are we've already admitted it the unlimited nature of the witness is brahman that this unlimited witness which you are not subject to change not subject to birth and death not subject to coming and going not of this kind of that kind this unlimited nature of awareness which you are that is brahman that is sat that is chit the moment you realize that it is unlimited it is also ananda that is sachidananda and say like probably on the intellectual level it's very clear to me and also in the experiential kind of way it's also very clear although i still watch all of the desires going through me proving me with all kinds of ways messing me up right there once one has realized one has understood this it's intellectual level i realize it and in a certain sense you are saying experientially is also it's there it's a matter of noticing it it's a matter of noticing it and it's a matter of staying with that noticing that staying with that noticing is called nididhyasana vedantic meditation and from that perspective whenever you have a problem desires are coming and messing me up you watch whose desire what is that desire what does it what kind of hole does it have upon me it is some hold when i am the ego but does it have any hold upon me who is complaining is my ego yes and once you do that would you still have some control over it eventually yes eventually yes not straight away because this realization which is also in the mind the the clarity is coming in the mind the witness consciousness needs no clarity it's always there it's why we can't put it this way um you have a curtain and there's a hole in the curtain which which shows you the reality behind the curtain it's just the hole which is getting bigger and bigger it's not the reality getting bigger and bigger the reality behind behind the curtain is you you're always perfect from your perspective it's all right it's just the hole in it's the hole in the clouds which covers the perfect blue sky that hole is getting bigger as the clouds are dissipating that will take time okay this is a very good question um who else is asking a question you have to unmute yourself okay maurice you answered the first part of my question what i wrote in the chat about where does it leave us the spiritual seekers you already answered that now the question when somebody does get enlightened you said that the all the karmas leave but what about all right they still live to the extent of their priority right so there is this adjustment to be made it's a kind of bookkeeping adjustment all karmas are destroyed we just said in the gita just said by the fire of knowledge all karmas are burnt but the problem now is then we see the enlightened person is still there the body is there and certain things are going on you know good and bad keep happening to that person so something is generating all that remember these people were strong believers in the in karma cause and effect actions and consequences we clearly see a chain of consequences coming i understand it because i'm a limited beings under the sway of my karma but why is that enlightened being still there if all the karma is gone there should be no more consequences the body should drop off the moment of enlightenment but that's not a very good consequence because out of enlightenment if the body drops off after enlightenment enlightenment should be a one-way street too you know the suicide no enlightenment and suicide are not the same thing so after enlightenment clearly these people are still there why are they still hanging around it's good for us that they're hanging around because these are our teachers these are the masters from whom we learn they are they have seen and they teach us but what about karma the karma accountants are very finicky where is this coming from so the adjustment that's made is there is a kind of karma which continues by the way it's not not true but i'm going to tell you what the accepted theory is and then tell you why it's not true the idea is like this there's an archer it's a very ancient kind of paradigm there's an archer who is shooting arrows so um the archer has released an arrow has put another arrow on the bow to shoot and there are arrows in the quiver which is uh there suddenly he decides not to shoot anymore so he throws away the arrow which he had in his hand and all the arrows in the quiver he throws them away so he will not shoot any more arrows but he has no control over the arrow which is in flight already released that will go and hit its target that's one example of prarabdha karma prada the camera means which has completely begun it's totally in motion another example is the wheel the potter's wheel so there's a potter who is working on the wheel and has finished work and gets up and leaves but the wheel doesn't fall down doesn't stop immediately if he's given it a good shove it will go around a couple of circles and then fall down that's like the plot of the karma swami vivekananda in his beautiful poem the song of the sannyasin the last verse is after enlightenment oh thou after enlightenment what do you do so no more has maya any power over you and go now from place to place and help them out of maya's veil that's your only duty left now or only work left for you to help people be to go beyond maya you have gone beyond help others to go beyond this body he not how it lives or dies and then he says let karma float it down if that's the original last worse so let karma float it down means this prada up the karma it will go on for a while the fan in the room if i switch it off it won't stop immediately go around half a circle so these are all examples uh like analogies to prove that something goes on and that's what explains the persistence a temp a short persistence of the enlightened person and after the death of the body of the enlightened person the subtle body of the enlightened person goes back to nature physical body goes back to nature like everybody else when we die the physical body goes back to nature the five elements in the body go back to the five elements in nature and for us the subtle body the that which limits the atman it continues from lifetime to lifetime propelled by karma but for the enlightened person who knows that i am the infinite the subtle body is no longer a cage so it goes back uh to nature also subtle body and physical body both are made of nature all right so this is the let's say the theology behind it the bookkeeping to keep karma books straight now shankaracharya he denies it flat out he says there really some something there's something deeper than this upon enlightenment what does one really realize that i was going through lifetimes propelled by this load of karma at my back and now i'm set free thank god only this lifetime and after this eternal peace is that what what the enlightened person realizes he says no not at all the enlightened person realizes there were no life times there was never a time ever i was in bondage because not in bondage there is no question of past karma also all of that is a fiction from our relative perspective to set our books straight if you ask an enlightened person so i gather your enlightened mr enlightened person mr buddha or jeevan mukhtar so you have no future births but i know you are being propelled along by your prayer of the karma you'll just laugh none of it has any meaning for that person yeah but we need to make sense of it so that's what we do that's why that swami buddhist answer was so perceptive when he was asked so how does the enlightened being see the whole thing his answer was who sees thank you yeah right by the way the prayer of the karma theory that's the standard advaithic explanation that's what you will find in just about every book what i said is a deeper uh explanation but it works both are correct one works from our perspective and one it's good for the textbooks it makes the whole thing rational logical but the reality is what i i said just now what shankaracharya points out in a production booth yeah um all right then we have gone beyond time see he takes up the question shankaracharya that this enlightenment applies enlightenment and the question of action after enlightenment applies equally to monks who withdraw from worldly activities and to householders who are still in worldly activities both can be enlightened the difference is this for the unenlightened both activity and passivity are problems when you one monk put it gave another nasty story to example to explain this imagine there's a dog and the dog has fleas so when it goes and sits in the sun the fleas bite it and tormented by the fleas the dog flees to a to shade and to hide there the fleas become dormant in the shade but now the dog has parasites in its brain and in the darkness the parasites start biting inside the brain and the dog tormented by the you know the pain in the brain rushes out into the sunlight where the parasites shut down but the fleas become active again this is that is the condition of uh this is our condition engagement in the world it is problematic the fleas are it could be troublesome people it could be you know problems like physical health mental problems financial problems covet problems what not those are the fleas from the world withdraw from it run away into a cave sit there and meditate you will have the parasites in the brain which will start biting from inside frustration unhappiness loneliness um meaninglessness what am i doing and people are out there doing great things they are not but that's what the mind will tell you when you're sitting in a cave and then you're pushed out into the world again same problem whereas for the for the enlightened person krishna is saying neither activity nor passivity is a problem that person can be an intense activity like krishna himself or can withdraw from activity like ramana maharshi or tortapuri wander around not connected with anything like a traditional wandering monk of whom there are still some in india were enlightened it could be like that and neither is a problem for the enlightened person so the difference is is this crucial difference is not in involvement and lack of involvement the difference is not in activity or passivity karma no karma that's not the difference the difference is knowledge and ignorance being enlightened not being enlightened that's the difference that's the crucial difference from our perspective it seems there's a huge difference between a person sitting in the mountain cave and a person actively engaged in in society and in family life but from krishna's perspective the real difference is between enlightenment and not and being in ignorance that's the difference um so swami ranganathan is beautiful summation of spiritual life it says when i open when i close my eyes i find peace within when i open my eyes my attitude is what can i do for you and that is the sum and substance of spirituality where does that come from from enlightenment if that's not there open my eyes what can i get from you from you the world close my eyes no peace within lack of peace restlessness unhappiness anxiety within that is because of ignorance okay that's a good point to end on [Music] to