Video 45

45. Bhagavad Gita I Chapter 4 Verses 7-8 I Swami Sarvapriyananda

[Music] [Music] so in the bhagavad-gita we are studying chapter 4. in the two earlier chapters chapters two and three sri krishna has taught arjuna vedanta the science of self-realization a solution to all our problems that attainment of human goals the ultimate human goal of enlightenment that is possible through self-realization and that is what was taught in the second chapter question remained that yes self-realization is uh is our goal is our path and our goal but what do i do with this life the life that i'm leading in arjuna's case the war that he had to fight do i fight this do i not fight it do i lead my life in a different way do i become a monk so that's the third chapter and shri krishna says that karma yoga he teaches him karma yoga how to spiritualize his life so whatever action we are doing we do it as a worship of god spiritualize our our life you see these are the two primary questions in spiritual life you know how do i realize god or how do i become enlightened that's one and what do i do with this life my other than spiritual what else is there in my life how do i deal with that how to how do i spiritualize it how do i connect it to my spiritual life so having done this then shri krishna at the beginning of the fourth chapter he praises this knowledge he says this is an ancient knowledge and i gave this knowledge at the beginning of creation to viva swan this the sun god and who passed it down in a lineage of yoga teachers down to manu the founder of the human race and ikshwaku the first king of the solar dynasty these are terms very famous familiar in india surya chandra and all of that and so note one thing arjuna is a warrior he's not a monk he's not a brahmin priest arjuna is a body at akshatriya and all of these they were like ikshwaku so it's a lineage of philosopher kings so in one way krishna is telling us you know this this thing is very practical for you look your ancestors they practice this kind of spirituality then he also mentioned something interesting that the spirituality got lost over time it declines and we know how religion does not remain as fresh as it does at the time of the founder and over time many things happen it becomes organized politics enters into it wealth enters into it then rituals comes into it all kinds of theology theologies and theories come into it and then what is essential and what is non-essential gets mixed up so he says i again i have come and i'm giving you the same teaching so look how he establishes a lineage a pedigree of the teaching this is that ancient knowledge which was there at the beginning of creation and this is the same thing that i'm teaching you now now arjuna asks a question like a good lawyer he immediately finds the loophole in this whole sequence how is it that you taught at the beginning of creation and you were teaching me you were my age you were born maybe just a few years before me how did you teach the sun god at the beginning of creation so this is the occasion for krishna to reveal that great secret that he is an incarnation he is not just a charioteer he is not just arjuna's friend he is not just the son of vasudeva he is he is not just a yogi or a wise person but actually the incarnation of god and he says that i have had many lives so have you but you you don't know them i know them which means my knowledge is is i'm omniscient you have lost uh knowledge of what has happened to you in the past but i know all of this not only my births but i know your births also i know everything omniscience means he is god i taught at the beginning of creation now in vedic in the vedic system the vedic knowledge is timeless it's with god so by by the vedas as vivekananda said no books are meant it means eternal spiritual knowledge so in every cycle of creation god is supposed to reveal it um to those at the beginning of creation and then this knowledge is passed down from teacher to student and so on at one time it gets codified into books so that means when krishna is claiming that i did this he is claiming that in the beginning of creation if i gave this knowledge then who am i i am god so that's the claim but literally he is not vishnu or narayana who is who is god or you know brahman he is krishna so he is an incarnation of god so god has appeared in this form so this is the divine mystery of the incarnation and we talked about how is this incarnation different from the rest of us we have bodies incarnation is also as a body looks like us seems to be born seems to age and die just like us seems to have sufferings in life and challenges in life just like us even if we we grant that the avatar our incarnation is very holy very spiritual extraordinary but there are also holy and spiritual people how is the incarnation different from say a jeevan mukhta an enlightened person so how are they uh what did what conclusion did we come to so this whole theory of incarnation avatar makes in essence a few points first of all the incarnation is it comes out of freedom god incarnates in a human form or in hinduism in many forms so in human form out of freedom we do not incarnate out of freedom we come because of our past karma god comes out of our own choice nobody gave us a choice we don't remember filling out the form these will be my parents this is where i'll be born this kind of body i want this much money i will have none of these are our options nothing it is all dictated by my past karma and that's why i've got this life this body and the major events of this life but god incarnates in full freedom in full omniscience in full knowledge the the second difference would be the body of the of the incarnation is not like us so this is the the whole theory of the in uniqueness of incarnations our body is made of material elements five elements in sanskrit pancha bhatika but the incarnations body is supposed to be a direct product of maya krishna says that by using my maya again and again he is look he's identifying himself with god my maya who can say my only god brahman can say that so i have i have embodied myself we don't use that language we don't say i have embodied myself i have descended upon this world no we are born helplessly so so that is another difference and then the purpose the purpose is very different we are born because of our karma and the purpose is to exhaust the results of our karma we get the results of our good karma and our bad karma a part of that which is called prarabdha karma that is exhausted in this birth and we generate new karma as we go along ensuring further births good or bad and the ultimate purpose of all of this is supposed to be god realization enlightenment moksha so this is our purpose but that's not at all the purpose of the incarnation incarnation does not have any karma this the incarnation is not under the sway of karma god in fact is the master one of the terms used for god in in hinduism is karma dhyaksha the lord of karma who gives us our karma the results of our karma so the lord is not at all under the sway of karma um so the purpose of the lord is our welfare especially our spiritual welfare when spirituality declines the lord comes to uphold spirituality ethics morality spirituality all of that it it seems to decline and the lord comes to uphold um ethical life moral life for the welfare of the world especially for the welfare of those who are seeking spirituality um one might ask why only spirit why does the god why does god come as incarnation only for spirituality only for religion why not for the economy or for for taking care of the kovat or something like that you know the economy is going into a cycle economy is famous for going through cycles not just religion so if god could come as an economic incarnation and rescue the economy no no no only for religion or spirituality why because again it ties back to the ultimate purpose of this entire creation and our existence our existence is not to be an economic person our existence ultimately is for and for enlightenment for realizing our oneness with god that's god's god has a very one-track mind that god is very clear about god's purpose god's purpose is to lead us to enlightenment the rest of it civilization science art economy all of it is part of our enlightenment process they are not separate it's a grand project but ultimately it's enlightenment which matters god realization which matters even human civilization is part of the process towards enlightenment aurobindo is to say life itself is yoga life itself is yoga the whole of life is actually yoga when you know it and you pursue spiritual practices consciously you call yourself a yogi a spiritual seeker otherwise you just say i'm living my life but living that life is also part of god's plan ultimately to take us towards god realization do it knowingly you're a spiritual seeker a yogi do it unlovingly i'm just drifting along in life and you're just living your life so that is the purpose now in the seventh verse sri krishna is talking to is telling arjuna about the purpose of the incarnation of god let me do the already people have asked questions um and made comments we'll go through that let me just read the famous verses people those who know the bhagavad gita um even if they know just one verse it's usually this one the seventh verse uh in india you say bhagavad gita many people just know this one person a particular verse and that's the seventh verse of the fourth chapter [Music] ham righteousness declines and unrighteousness prevails i project myself so your incarnation when do you come and why do you come here is the answer whenever dharma glanir bhavati means when it declines when there is confusion regarding what is religion for is it true no more than no more so than in our day and age where the whole idea of religion is under attack somebody said in all of known history never has there been a time like ours where large numbers if not the majority but large numbers of people are agnostic or atheistic they are not interested in religion or they actively disbelieve religion so never has there been such a time in human history there have been times and all throughout human history there have been skeptics people who don't believe in it people who question the very validity of religion people who are out and out materialists we hear of charvakas in ancient indian philosophy so it's been a popular philosophy throughout the out and out materialist who says all i believe only what i see with my senses and this material world alone is is true my body is i am my body what is the self the body is the self that's it we are i am created with the birth of the body and i'll die with the death of the body it's entirely a material existence and their tribe continues to grow now it is a very powerful philosophy with especially with the support of and the power and prestige of science so gladial bhavati decline in religion and spirituality not just spirituality i mean the whole of religion whole of religion declines by the way when i say whole of religion vedant or hinduism is very clear what is meant at the beginning of the bhagavad-gita commentary on the bhagavad-gita shankaracharya says the vedic religion has two aspects pravriti lakshana nivriti lakshana means the outward moving aspect literally privately means outward moving aspects um swine vivekananda called it the centripetal and centrifugal so one kind of religion is that which projects itself outwards you want a prosperous life you want god's protection primitive man wanted that that god watch over my tribe let him protect my children from diseases let the crops prosper let the enemies be destroyed let our cattle increase so all kinds of materially and we expect god's uh protection for a good material life earthly life so that is called pravrtti lakshmana dharma and do not denigrate it for two reasons first of all the majority of people who believe in religion believe in that it for that and the second thing is that is it protects the higher spirituality god realization moksha and all of that would not have been possible without the outer superstructure of religion temples and priests and churches and all of that though people go there for material benefits this world your other world benefits that is the pravriti dharma the outward religion outward moving religion but still it is the foundation of religion if that was not there the other would also disappear somebody compared it nicely to a coconut that there's a hard shell outside and there's the delicious fruit the delicious flesh of the coconut inside that's what we want but without the shell the flesh of the coconut would perish would not come to maturity and would perish and people move from this outward moving religion to the inward moving religion sri krishna later on will say devotees are of four kinds those who want material things those who want to be rescued from trouble you know in times of kovid the interest in religion increases not because people want enlightenment people want um you know safety security and a sense of peace overcome anxiety so that's the outward kind of religion but then he says that the third kind of devotee first kind of devotee wants to be rescued from trouble second kind of devotee wants more things in life a better life third kind of devotee inquires is there god what is the purpose of life can i experience god like narendra not going to ramakrishna saying have you seen god so on so and the fourth kind of devotee is the one who is already enlightened has seen god so these are the four kinds and krishna says they're all good but the last one is specially dear to me the first two belong to this outward moving religion that means the private election of dharma the next two the enquirer and the enlightened one so we are all inquirers among us one or two a few lucky few might be already enlightened but we belong to the second kind of religion the higher spirituality which is called nibriti lakshana dharma but an incarnation comes for all of it an incarnation does not come only for enlightenment or a few monks or highly advanced spiritual seekers for everybody and that's what krishna will talk about soon all of religion is uplifted when so at that time i come it is also characterized by not only a decline of religion but also a bhutana madhar masaya an increase in in evil in wickedness in disbelief tadat then i project myself forth myself i project myself so who is there prior to the incarnation god only ishwara brahman saguna brahman so so that is the purpose what do you do so what are your activities i'll do the eighth one and then stop and take a few questions [Music] s for the protection of the virtuous the destruction of the wicked and to secure establishment of righteousness i am born in every age sambhavami yugi yuki incarnation comes so multiple incarnations this is a standard doctrine in hinduism especially vaishnava hinduism god has come many times many people have heard of the 10 incarnations of vishnu but the bhagavatam speaks of 24 incarnations and many many incarnations incarnations as krishna says here i come age after age so when do i come when in the in that particular age religion declines wickedness increases then i come for the protection of religion how do you protect religion two ways one paritranaya sadhunam i um for the emancipation for the protection of sadhus means good people virtuous people people who follow dharma religion i come to protect them and the second thing is vinashaya chuduskritam for the destruction of the wicked so in these two ways i protect religion and the third one is dharma sangstha panartha in order to rest establish or re-establish it literally means established but it means re-establish actually um so sort of re-vivify revitalize religion in every age i am born i come forth now paritranaya sadhunam for the welfare or protection of the good protection might mean um you know actual physical protection as the rama you know he fights with the demons with his arrows or krishna protects the pandavas uh from the from the kauravas so the in the fight between good and evil the lord comes to protect the good but also specifically those who are spiritual seekers those who are already advanced those who want god god's the incarnations first purpose is for them really the first beneficiaries the greatest beneficiaries of krishna are his close disciples the gopis and like uddhava and arjuna directly and they will get enlightenment surely the first uh beneficiaries of jesus are the apostles first beneficiaries of chaitanya sri ramakrishna are the group of advanced spiritual seekers both monastic and householder who gather around a recognized incarnation in the lifetime of the incarnation many might not recognize them krishna was hated by the kauravas they were loved by the pandavas jesus only a small group of people recognized him others they reviled him and ultimately crucified him uh the surama krishna was considered mad by most people in in the dakshin issued kali temple only the closest devotees they recognize the divinity in this person in the lifetime but what is the proof then there is an incarnation during the lifetime and soon afterwards it grows tremendously as life goes by as time goes by centuries millennia the the presence of the incarnation keeps on growing over time we will completely forgot forget all the other people no matter how great who lived around that time but as centuries go by the stature of the incarnation will only grow so first beneficiary are those who are spiritual so the destruction of the evil now in in ancient ages it might have been physical destruction of demons you hear of rama fighting against the demons or risimbhav coming and destroying the great demon king rakshasa king hiranyakashipu and so on but now over time right now it might mean just reforming the wicked changing people from being grossly materialistic given to evil ways and rising them to a moral ethical life and finally to a spiritual life so that might that's what it means i remember a funny incident which took place many many years ago about 15 years ago in india so i was invited to give a talk in a village outside calcutta and they asked me so we'll send a vehicle vehicle for you is anybody else coming and i was surprised i said no that's i've been told that i am supposed to go all right so i went to this village and it was really a proper village quite outside the city and they had put up a big stage with a with a tarp a tarpon in top of it and the villagers came through the fields rice fields and came and sat in front on big mats to listen to it listen to the talk and they will always be a village expert because the crowd is is fluid people are coming and people are leaving so they want me to be the star speaker so there is an expert who who knows the village who knows that this is the peak of the crowd so he says he'll say i'll come and tell you when to come on stage and after this and he he did come and tell me swami come and come come and give your talk now because after this the crowd is only going to decrease no it won't increase any further so i went there how long should i speak oh before i s my speech this is what i wanted to say which is relevant here there was this village school master school teacher who gave a very nice speech i still remember about incarnations he said in ancient ages the incarnation of god vishnu nisingawatara the half-lion half-man he comes and goes straight into the realm of the demons and kills the evil hiranyakashipu there's a famous story and then in the in a later age comes ramachandra the incarnation rama who crosses the ocean and rescues sita from ravana and and destroys ravana and all the rakshasas and then in still later age comes krishna who is right here in india and he fights the battle between the the on the side of the good the pandavas against the core of us and in this age sri ramakrishna has come and the battlefield is in our hearts in everybody's heart there's a good and bad and with the help of suramar krishna the good forces within us will win over the bad forces the good will win over the evil so i thought that's very interesting he's gone from ancient ages from interplanetary warfare to in you know hiranyakupu and all to rama crossing the ocean to sri lanka it's an international warfare to the kauravas and the pandavas within india that is like a civil war to ultimately within internally within each of us a battle between good and evil inside us so i really like that speed and then i was asked to speak and i asked how long do i have to speak and i am not kidding you they said until the sun sets i said i've never heard of such a thing until the sun sets just me that's what i'm whispering in my ear that's why we asked you is there somebody else coming you should have told me and i don't know how long it's going to take for the sun to set so i started as far back as i could with the birth of sri ramakrishna and i told the story in detail sri ramakrishnan everything kamar pakur is coming to dakshineshwar and the birth of vivekananda so a holy mother the direct disciples and by the time vivekananda goes to chicago i'm looking you know desperately at the sun you have to set because i'm running out of material so anyway it went off well enough so destruction of the wicked in past ages might have meant these great mythical battles um but it's basically a moral battle between good and evil and more important dharma some stop and are tired so when swami vivekananda composed the salutation to sri ramakrishna the one who establishes dharma that is immediately a characteristic of an incarnation so there itself swami vivekananda signaling that this is an incarnation of god in fact vivekananda said in his famous calcutta address when he came back to india after his first tour of the united states so in calcutta they gave him a big reception and by the way many people don't know they sent him a bill for that afterwards as if he wanted the reception so they gave him a big reception in that he gave up he rarely referred to sri ramakrishna to his master but there he did it was the city of his master sri ramakrishna and he referred to it and he said we have all heard of the incarnation of rama in past ages and krishna such a thing is before us again he says even then though sriram krishna was already well known in calcutta but still to openly proclaim him it's a pretty bold step and we can recognize him as a saint as a wonderful mistake maybe the greatest figure as somebody recently said uh um ruth harris who's a professor at oxford university was giving a talk in um at harvard university she's writing a new book on on vivekananda and she said the first time i've heard an academic said out out and an academic of her stager from oxford and talking at harvard she said so his master was sri ramakrishna the greatest figure in hinduism in modern times possibly the greatest religious figure of our age so this is the first time i'm hearing this coming from a high class a top class secular scholar anyway so the one who establishes religion uh swain vivekan also went on to say those of you are lucky those who can see it come and help in this work the work of the avatar those who do not yeah then just stand aside do not oppose this because this is the work of god and you you can only oppose it at you at your own peril ah just a minute what is the establishment of religion establishment of religion is to show what true religion is i've said this earlier it's mixed up with it goes undergoes decline and imagine the amount of decline in hinduism especially at the time of sri ramakrishna's advent so what is true religion god realization is the purpose of religion true religion is devotion it is dispassion it is knowledge the purpose of life is enlightenment and these are the different paths to enlightenment that religion is a path to god seems so simple but it's it took somebody like sudama krishna to say it out and vivekananda to proclaim it to the world otherwise you go to i spent one year at the divinity school do they know that not really so religion might be something which gives ethics to humanity is important for social cohesion or something or the other a dozen different approaches to religion the core of religion see why does this happen it happens because you lose faith in god it happens because people stop really believing that there is such a thing as god and then start looking for why does this religion exist at all why does anything called religion then they try to look for economic reasons social reasons political reasons so and so forth or at best ethical reasons so what is true religion the incarnation establishes it and also sets out a new path um the avatar himself is a path of spirituality quite apart from devotion knowledge meditation advaitha all of that is there they are all there eternally but the incarnation avatar i've never heard the term avatar or yoga but it should be there it's a very very powerful path if you look in look at hinduism most people who actually practice and are devoted they are devoted either to krishna or rama one of the incarnations of god lots of people in hinduism all of christianity is built around an incarnation of god there is no essence to christianity without the incarnation so the incarnation is very very important to religion and especially for people who want spiritual progress a very powerful method is the incarnation of a very powerful very great power which helps us in spiritual life is the incarnation sriram krishna has compared it to the steamboat you know others can barely float across the river he by others he means great saints a little twig floating across the river will float across and go to the ocean with the river remember he lived at the in the at the end of the ganges ganga where the ganga flows into the bay of bengal so it will float everything floats into the ocean so the river takes you to the ocean of brahman but if even a crow sits on the twig it's going to sink so and you can actually see that the crows flying across the river in ganga and they might sometimes try to they get tired try to alight on a twig and they'll see it sinking if they put their weight on it but a steamer can take hundreds of people across without any fear without any any extra effort so an avatar is like that what would not have been possible for us spiritually in one life becomes possible by holding on to the avatar so that is a central part of establishment or re-establishment of religion okay we have some questions giant i'll stop at this point and take a few questions because then the next verse is very important requires separate treatment my question is coming from a two years uh training on mandu i mean i i i'm reconciled with that we are we are born how we are born because of karma but when somebody says that i am born by my own maya that means i have to believe that there is a god so again there is no proof that there is a god of my record when i say god i believe that there is only one god in the world has to be there cannot be a god for hindus and one god for christians and one god for islam so how do i reconcile all these things all right i haven't disturbed myself and i worship yes right right but when it comes to reasoning i get knocked off actually right so you have asked three questions um so is belief in god a matter of faith second what is the proof that there is god and is there one god or many gods so the other as actually has three questions um so very briefly i'll answer in one word each of them and then we'll take a little more time on the questions first of all is it a matter of faith yes it's a matter of faith it's not like advaita vedanta so this is definitely a matter of faith what krishna is saying here has to be accepted by arjuna as a matter of faith on belief second is there proof yes and no we've discussed what what do you mean by proof and what kind of proof third is there one god yes definitely that was the great advance of monotheism that you know judaism which said that there is one god and in hinduism you find multiplicity of devatas and then culminating in one god of the universe so there is one power which creates preserves and destroys the universe except that in hinduism it can be understood in many many different ways because of its infinite nature all right little more time on each of these questions is it a matter of faith yes it's a matter of matter of faith in contrast with what's going on mandu kyopunishan or manduka karika in manduka karika it's a matter of experience and reason not just experience everybody has experience that does not mean that they become advaitans or become enlightened you need the the teachings uh the which which talk about your experience what experience waking dreaming deep sleep in the mandukya all of the upanishads are like that they talk about your experience and and guide you towards enlightenment self-realization that is what krishna was talking about in the second chapter of the bhagavad-gita self-realization there arjuna will not ask even you will not ask what is the proof that i exist nobody asks that i exist what is the nature advaita says i am existence consciousness bliss and infinite being that that will require investigation but the subject matter about which advaita vedanta says that you are sachidan and you are the atman or brahman that one nobody doubts even the buddhist does not doubt it the buddhist says it's a stream of flickering consciousness momentary consciousness but it does not doubt that we experience a self what is the nature of the self that's open to question but the nature of god is a matter of faith the nature of god is a matter of matter of faith now the second question is there proof yes the all the theistic religions the religions which believe in the existence of god a common denom first of all you have to define what is god one useful way of defining god is all the theistic religions in india in hinduism and also in the middle east whether christianity islam judaism zoroastrianism they all think of god as the creator so the most ancient texts think of god is the creator you can think of ancient man thinking about this universe looking at this universe and asking what is behind all this where did all this come from so one thing is where did all this come from so they thought there must be some supreme power which can make all this god second thing is who is there something is the power which controls all of this an amazing power yes so that's another thing about god omnipotent and you add omniscient to it so the cause of the universe that's a common idea among all theistic religions and also has excellent qualities like omniscience omnipotence omnipresence and so on so forth such a being is there proof i actually have a two hour lecture on this proofs of the existence of god but every theistic religion has tried to prove the existence of god uh in christianity you have the famous five the five proofs of the existence of god the niyah philosopher in india the nayakas the school they were famous for their believers in god and they tried to improve the existence of god their opponents were the buddhists who said who denied two things there is no permanent eternal soul one atma no atma and there is no guard of this universe so that's what they debated with against the ancient hindus a debate which lasted nearly a thousand years who won both sides claimed big victory but anyway but what what one was indian philosophy because so many texts so many it's a wonderful flowering development of indian philosophy udain acharya was one of the great uh philosophers has already had a tradition of giving proofs for the existence of god he gives nine proofs of the existence of god so what are these proofs maybe one day we can have a separate talk i can introduce you to the proofs of the existence of god now yes now how are the proofs as i said yes and no you will see all of these are proofs only in the sense a lawyer would would try to prove something what does a lawyer do the lawyer he or she piles up evidence to convince the judge and the jury of the merits of the case so a lot of evidence so the uh the proof of the lawyer the so-called proof of the lawyer is not a mathematical proof not even a scientific proof it's a persuasive proof an argumentative like i'm trying to persuade you of the merits of my case you may choose to be convinced or may not be that does not mean i'm just telling you you have to believe me no lawyer ever says you have to believe me i'm trying to show you why i am right and so are you convinced or not all of these proofs are like that the proof from first cause the proof of design proof by design the proof of teleology is a purpose of the whole universe from moral from the argument from the moral sense um the the incre interesting ontological argument all of these are sort of persuasive but they are not like mathematical proofs where you don't have to persuade if anybody understands mathematics the thing is done and mathematical proofs are also proof against any kind of evidence there is no question of it being refuted later when new evidence comes up no it depends entirely on internal logic so anybody who's understood mathematics will understand the proofs will be convinced by it is no other way if you are not convinced by a mathematical proof the only thing is that you have not understood it so these proofs are not like that are they convincing depends if you are already a believer if you believe in god or you would like to believe in god you will like these proofs if you are not convinced if you take these proofs to richard dawkins you will be laughed out then no the one a skeptic is not going to believe in any of these proofs in fact i know of a famous philosopher maybe anthony kenny i forget very well known philosopher contemporary who started out by training to be a priest a catholic priest and in part of his training he studied the proofs of the existence of god and he thought now i can't believe in god if this these are the proofs that i have i lose my so he became a philosopher instead of a theologian so that's that one interesting footnote here is probably the greatest mathematician logician of our age kurt godel who was right here in princeton in the institute of advanced studies he is very well known for his incompleteness theorems and the incredible brain but not many people know that among his unfinished work was a mathematical proof of the existence of god so right here the finest scientific brains in the institute of advanced studies a colleague of einstein who who einstein was the only one gorille spoke to he didn't trust anybody did not like anybody and einstein liked everybody and trusted everybody sansan spoke to everybody the neighbors and the neighbors kid and the staff members and professors and everybody and and also godel uh but godel spoke only to einstein and they argued over it so if you google it godel's proof of god it's a it's supposed to be an incomplete kind of effort but imagine a brain like that a band like that thought it worthwhile that one can actually prove the existence of god one god are many gods one god the movement has always been from polytheism to monotheism but advaita vedanta goes beyond that see what advaita vedanta says is that there is one ultimate reality which appears as three brahman because of maya appears as three things one is god the universe and individual beings like us all three are ultimately not real they are brahman not real means they are brahman they are really brahmana god is really brahmana i mean nirguna brahman the absolute coming through maya nir guna brahman plus maya becomes ishvara or saguna brahman and sargon abraham produces this universe and helps in producing our bodies and minds another product of maya maya makes nirguna brahman appear as individual sentient beings and our bodies and minds are given to us by this world jagat which is which is created by ishwara so we have a triangle god world i the individual being what advaita says is the reality of all of this is brahman all right is it possible that ramachandra was incarnate born as krishna and then krishna was born as ramakrishna yes yes of course it is the same it's the same god so it is the same god what is going on yes yes it is the same god when krishna says i have had many births previously he what does he mean he means all the incarnations in all ages known and unknown we do not know of many things so it is it is there is only one god who incarnates in all these ways i am there is a new fashion in academics now in theological studies this is always a resistance to this idea that ultimately all religions are speaking about the same thing ultimately in in details they are obviously different there's nobody who's denying it but there is a new academic push back again against the perennial philosophy they say no no the religions are different they're different everybody knows that ultimately is it one reality they are pointing towards this now this it's academically fashionable to say no it's fashionable to find difference everywhere so no they are pointing towards different realities i have never understood that when you say that buddhism christianity judaism um hinduism they're pointing to different realities are you talking then are you admitting polytheism which is obviously impossible for especially western theologian with the judio christian background to admit see what i what i think is that the what is behind this kind of push against the perennial philosophy is first of all the influence of post-modernism where you have to find difference in everything there cannot be any grand unifying narrative everything has to be different and also everything has to be false that also is at the background and i lied to this there might be a kind of fanaticism a kind of remnant of fanaticism remember a fanatic always says yes there are different religions but there's only one true religion and somehow it happens to be mine so there are different gods but there's only one god and others are not true and somehow that one god happens to be the one that that speaker is talking about that my god so that's the fanatic now it's no longer to be no longer fashionable nor acceptable to be fanatical in that sense people will laugh at you it will be politically incorrect so a strategic way of being fanatic is not to accept that my religion is saying the same thing as real religion ultimately no my religion is saying something different your religion is saying something different every religion is saying something different and the footnote footnote would say those ones are wrong and mine is correct that's a sneaky way of introducing fanaticism and these are my theories and why uh i mean just compare that the two books one is aldous huxley's classic the perennial philosophy i think 1960s and our 50s and then there's a new one god is not one i forget the name of the author i read this book also even in quality it doesn't compare you will read one paragraph elder saxley's english and this new academician saying it doesn't compare arguments don't compare then you you begin to under question what is the purpose of this book why is it being written what's the agenda behind it an agenda is basically it stinks basically um okay god is not one yeah um stephen that's right that's the book i'm not recommending it by the way but if you want to read if you want to read aldous actually is perennial philosophy is really worth reading who else raised the hand yes um i i wanted to ask you this question you told us the other night about an ancient monk who you had been around during world war ii and when you asked him what that experience was his reply was what concern is that to us yes krishna on the other hand advises arjuna to take action actively destroy evil but established in yoga now i can sort of understand both these statements because despite the fact they're somewhat contradictory one is it being indifferent and the other being active but my question is this given the given the current situation with you know politics the pandemic and the recession what should an unenlightened person like me do should i be as indifferent as the old monk rationalize evil as a mere appearance in brahman that i can't do anything about or do i engage in action though i am far from being you know established in yoga so to speak it's a difficult question but a good question nevertheless that swami was swami pavanan he was an irishman who lived all his after becoming a monk lived the rest of his life in yoga in in the ashram which i joined a very wonderful old swami but why he advised me that way there are certain point to it first of all here is this young novice who is supposed to concentrate on philosophy and meditation and service and spending all his time reading and luckily at that time there was no internet and nothing like that so the only sources were encyclopedias who's pouring over uh second world war entries and encyclopedias you know and it's a fascination the monastic life one has to be careful to um to be careful about these fascinations otherwise what happens is your focus should be the four yogas you know ghana yoga bhakti as a part of that your karma yoga you might read the second world war if you're asked to teach history as i was asked to teach history but he noticed it was going beyond the just the need for karma yoga it's just a personal fascination so it's actually very very laudable what he talked about that that he was he was an irishman a european in india during the second world war the very natural thing would have been to pour over at that time maybe the radio news or the newspapers whatever he got over and whatever he got at that time and to follow the war and details and everything no he chose not to be involved in that was he indifferent no he was always very active active in the field of karma yoga which was given to him which was serving the students who studied there he always taught he was the one who introduced haki into that school he was the one who taught english to the students all his life generations grandfather father and son have studied under him so a life of service he was not indifferent at all but then that's one thing he's a monk now we are part of society here and you are asking from your perspective the answer is something that you have to find yourself i'll give you two examples one is um in the first world war in cambridge so bertrand russell and the great philosopher wittgenstein russell and wittenstein russell decided not to fight the war pacifist he was actually put in jail i think he was dismissed because then during the war when your country is fighting and you say i will be a pacifist i will not join the war he stood up for his ideals he suffered for it he paid for it wittgenstein on the other hand uh he said i have to fight for my country the honest thing to do is to fight for your country and he went and joined the army this super philosopher the austrian army and he fought in the battle he was even reckless it seems when you read about his life and he was put in after the war did lost the war he was put in a prisoner of war camp he paid his dues he felt that it is honest to suffer with everybody else now what is right what i noticed one common thing among both of them that they were willing to sacrifice for their ideals both russell who said i will not fight i'm a pacifist and wittgenstein who said i have to fight for my country right or wrong it's my country patriotic duty i have to do and both of them suffered for it the second example i want to share is swami i've said this earlier also shivan and ji i really like that he was the president of the order in bellurmut and one gentleman he used to come visit him so one day he came and he was saying at that time gandhiji was fighting for the independence of india he was leading the non-cooperation movement against the british and people in calcutta the many the young people were joining that movement to fight against the british and this gentleman was disapproving of the whole thing he was telling mahaprabhu swami shivananda ji swamiji is it right that these young people they are not finishing their their studies they are neglecting their studies and dropping out of college and this gandhi is just a troublemaker you know fighting against the british empire whoever heard of such a thing and is this right so swami shivananda just said hmm yeah the next day he came again that day a young man had come to become a monk he bowed down before swami shivananda got his blessings and went up to the monastery to become a monk and the gentleman was watching the whole proceedings and he said swami is this right you know when the we are a colonized country and gandhiji is fighting for the freedom of the country is this isn't this selfish to give up this entire struggle and become a monk and sit in meditation close your eyes to what is going on in society outside then swami shivananda could take it no more he said look here gandhiji in his complete you know engagement he is fighting against the british for the independence of india he's trying to reform a hindu society and overcome untouchability so many things are going on instituting education so many things he is doing and i'm sure he's perfectly at peace he said he has joy and peace and calmness within and this young man has come with such a high ideal i'll give up all worldly ambition all greed and lust and i will i will search for god i will meditate and pray and serve and have one pointed request for god he too will find peace the only one i see without any peace is you who is doing neither so that is one thing definitely one must be engaged i in this case i like that what do you call it the serenity prayer and the theologian neighbor i think he said lord give me the courage to change the things that i can change the patience to bear that which i cannot change and the wisdom to know the difference yeah that's true all right um there's one more question yes one more question yeah swamiji i wanted to know the difference between oh that is a whole avatar a logic there's no such subject but there's a subject like christology and there's a subject called buddhalogy also so the different kinds of avataras some are like krishna and rama regarded as purnavatara that they manifest all the glories of god some are amshavatar they manifest in one aspect of divine power but they're also incarnations of god so i don't know too much i'm too much of a dry non-dualist and i don't have all the details on avatars all right i think we have run out of time so um one more let me look at the chat there were a lot of interesting questions which text of bhagavad-gita would you recommend anyone here is the ramakrishna mission text this is a translation of shankaracharya's commentary bhagavad-gita with the commentary of shankaracharya then you have so many there's firesteins um the one which we used at harvard i can show you the text right now it's right here this is a solid new translation this is the one was used as a textbook at harvard bhagavad-gita new translation george feuerstein he was a noted expert on yoga this book can you see george feinstein and there's another one which we used this one was actually published recently by cambridge university she's a professor at cambridge university i think uh angelica malinar i think she's a professor at cambridge so this is the book the bhagavad gita doctor doctrines and contents by malinar public publication cambridge university doctrine now don't uh look at this book for spiritual inspiration this is a completely academic text so you'll come across things like so today when i was preparing for this so what does professor malinar say so at the beginning of the fourth chapter krishna declares himself as an incarnation probably these verses were composed at a later date than the rest of the chapter because they don't match the contents of the other part of the chapter so we'll immediately get into this part has been inserted later on that part was written by somebody else this part doesn't matter doesn't krishna himself would be confused if you read this book but it's a solid academic test text i must say lot of good information is there she has studied ah mahabharata thoroughly and many other texts and she has bought in she is at the university of london school of oriental and african studies is a famous school soas university of london yeah these are two there are any number of translations there was also a recent one in poetic translation called god song actually bhagavad gita if you literally translate it in english it will mean god song so name of the book is god song and the book was reviewed in the new york times the new york times reviewer said that apparently to read the bhagavad gita is to be possessed by an irresistible desire to translate it so there have been so many many translations a couple of years back yale university had a summer camp on translations of the bhagavad-gita so they collected every translation in english i think yes they made a library of bhagavad-gita university all right um [Music] it seems that many incarnation of vishnu a result of a rishi's curse there's some reason for incarnation i've heard that avatars can be of different degrees correct rama full avatar lakshmanas and avatara yes and this is the whole field of research who is who's avatar um i found the english translation of ram suggests commentary on um ignati swaran's commentary is nice it's very like all of his writings it's very lucid inspiring poetic you need to have an inspiring translation the one from the from the vidhan society of society of southern california which was done by christopher isherwood in consultation with swami prabhavanandaji very nice a very poetic but it's a poetic translation it's not a precise translation from the sanskrit very poetic yes so these are some there are many many many translations then ram suggest if you want to read that very good the hindi is nice actually it's a very voluminous commentary on the bhagavad gita but if you don't know hindi then english is good all right then let's bring it to a close the ninth verse is actually an important verse i should not hurry through it we should start it in the next class [Music] namaste