Video 11

11. Bhagavad Gita I Chapter 2 Verses 28-29 I Swami Sarvapriyananda

Oh Vasudeva Suton daivam comes a charmer Dunham Devaki paramanandam krishnam vande a jagadguru we are studying the bhagavad-gita and we're in the second chapter of the 18 chapters the second chapter is the most important it basically contains the essence of the teaching and in the second chapter the teaching about the Atman our self who we really are that is the central teaching so that's what Shri Krishna has been telling Arjuna till now we have covered that part we have we have studied about that while wrapping up that teaching the doctrine of the Atman shri krishna mentions two important concepts in indian thought not just hindu vedanta or hindu thought but also Buddhists Jains seek the Indian an important concept of the Indic worldview what are these two concepts the first one is given in verse 27 and the second one in 28 we have done up to 27 last time in 27 Sri Krishna said for those who died before those who are born that is certain jiya Tasya he drove over to that is certain for those who are born this is common sense we all know this this is one truth that we all know without any kind of religion whether you're theist atheist whether you follow a religion Buddhist Christian Hindu whatever you are whatever we are we know that death is certain but the second part of that verse Dhruv on Jan mom Rita stated that is something new for those who are dead rebirth is certain so we die this body dies which means that we do not die with the death of the body there is something that is that continues and is again reborn in other lives in other bodies so this idea the doctrine of of reincarnation punar janma many lives many bodies this doctrine it's a central feature of Indian thought I have had occasion to mention this earlier that in spite of the tremendous diversity in ideas about God there are different schools of Hinduism which believe in God but God maybe with farm maybe without farm maybe male or female or beyond gender there are schools of Hinduism which do not believe in God there's Buddhism which does not believe in God does Jainism it does not believe in God there are different ideas about the nature of this universe about what is the nature of the human problem and what is the solution so many different ideas are there so many different practices are there but there's one thing common to all these streams of thought all throughout in ancient India all of them they believed in this idea this concept of reincarnation that this is not the only life that we have had we have had many lives in the past and we will continue to do so therefore we do not die with the death of the body death is death of the physical body but something continues over there is an afterlife and there are many lives in fact to come so this is a a very fundamental part of the Indic worldview and why Indic worldview I was just thinking all the religions of the world they all believe in some kind of afterlife I was at the New York ethical society and you know the one just down that it's in on 64th I think it's a very old institution it's 1876 1877 so their leader we were in a discussion yesterday in the evening and their leader was telling me how it came to be founded it's in 1876 Felix Adler who a Jewish man from Brooklyn who was training to be a rabbi he went to Germany and studied philosophy and it seems his mother warned him nothing good will come of that and it didn't depending on your perspective because he didn't learn he lost faith in God he said yeah he's not he doesn't he can't believe anymore in religion and God and all of that but definitely believes in values and ethics and meaning in life so he founded the ethical society here anyhow we were in a discussion and somebody raised the question what is so terrible if after death there is nothing simply that's the end of course there is matter I mean the body will disintegrate into the elements and so on the energy in this body will be released into the system but there is no personal continuity there's no continuity of the sentient being which we regard ourselves to be this one does not exist anymore after death what's so terrible about it what's so terrible about it what's wrong with that the only thing that I commented was to the discussion was what is terrible about it and what's wrong with that that it's a huge question but not one thing all the religions of the world from the most primitive cave dwellers they also talk did you see in the paintings there is their depictions of death and a spirit world afterwards all religions of the world all the traditions the native traditions in Australia in in America here in India and every part of the world and all the major world religions Judaism Christianity Islam Buddhism Jainism Hinduism all its varieties Sikhism all religions of the world Taoism Shintoism Taoism all above all of them Confucianism all of them believe that there is something that continues after death one lady she said no no I don't think there's any afterlife in Judaism I I've heard this from Jewish people that in Judaism we don't there's no heaven in Hell nothing after death but it's a wrong idea it just have to Google at once afterlife in Judaism immediate will get enormous amount of information the thing is and if you in fact look at the Bible the Old Testament all this idea of an immortal soul and heaven and hell did was the whole thing invented by Jesus no in fact Jesus his contribution is not so much original as taking out the essential spiritual teachings of the existing Judaic traditions and giving them in a new creative concentrated from it's not that he invented something in you so those were all there in there in the Hebrew texts in fact if you look at the entire Judaic tradition all the texts including the rabbinic tradition down the ages they are vague or or sometimes clear that there is an afterlife Maimonides the great teacher he spoke about not only one afterlife but a greater afterlife after that afterlife so very close to I was just thinking the Vedanta idea that we have many lives but ultimately the realities dwell all that will stop and we realize our ourselves as Brahman so the afterlife after the afterlife also makes sense actually anyhow so you have all these views but I noticed one thing I just all curtsy Google if it takes a five minute search you get all the data and noticed one thing there is no Jewish teacher throughout the history of Judaism who has said clearly there is no afterlife there there nobody has said clearly what a materialist might say there is nothing after death it all ends with death no Jewish teacher has ever said that and I my instinct to us was that that would be the case it's impossible to have religion without nothing beyond death so it's not just Hinduism every religion says some there's something after after death but the Indian religions go further and say that that afterlife it's like a cycle repetition we are reborn again and again some others may say that no they are not reborn again and again but we continue to exist in some kind of suspended animation until such certain things will happen and so on but every religion agrees that death is not the end so that's that's the point now shri krishna introduces that idea here an associated idea would with reincarnation is the law of karma or or the doctrine of karma I wouldn't say law of karma doctrine of karma what propels birth and death and rebirth what's behind all of that and the Hindu idea in fact Indian idea Hindu Buddhist giant Sikh is that it is cause and effect everything that we see these are consequences of certain causes set in motion in past lives and what we do now consciously our cause is being set in motion now forces being set in motion now which will give results in future since we we have this life it's an effect of past causes so we must have existed in the past if if this is true this train of thinking is true then we must have some in some form existed in the past and if all our karma is not existed in this present life if we generate new karma new causes in this life then we will have to exist to get the results of the photos Karma's in the future so many lives in the past and many lives extending to the foreseeable future that's what Sri Krishna introduced in 27th verse we did this last time the second important conception he introduces in 28 verse we shall see avatar Dini Bhutan II objector Dini Bhutan e-vector Madonna bird nanny bharata object anita non-evil object anita non-evil taut rock opera diva nam tok opera diva o descendant of bharata he means arjuna all beings have under unmanifest as their beginning are manifest in the middle and have their dissolution in the unmanifest itself so why lament for them here the Indian idea of creation and destruction or more precisely projection and withdrawal are is mentioned here he says since we have existed in the past and we will exist in the future after death also but how we were in the past is not known to us we were not in this form and what we would be in the future is not known to us certainly we will not be in this body so that was unmanifest it was not visible not not not present for our experience and the future is also not visible but what is available right now is this life so this is manifest but it goes beyond this what he wants to say is everything in this universe this state in which we find them he calls it we act our manifest manifest means available for experience they are available for experience so you can see them hear them talk with them or if any object in time-space matter energy living beings all of them they are manifest now you can see but there was a time when these were not there now the question is it did not exist at all or did they exist in some unmanifest for the vedantic idea which Krishna is introducing here is the idea of creation and destruction is not that there is creation from nothing there is creation from something and not that destruction is something into nothing it is something into something else let me make it a little more let me make it a little more clear suppose like an example is from a seed in the seed there is no tree right now there is a tree but before this tree was there it was a seed it did not pop out of existence in from thin air it was there as a seed and everything that you see in the tree at least in outline was there in the genetic material encoded in that seed but it was unmanifest what do I mean my unmanifest when I say everything of the tree was there in the seed I don't mean that if you investigate the seed will you find roots and branches and leaves and fruits and birds and nests on no nothing nothing you will not find any of that and yet the entire potential of the tree was there in the seed and now we know it much better with the advances in genetics for the last hundred 200 years we have known it especially with the discovery of in the recent years of of the chromosomes and the DNA so we know the the fact that what we see expressed as living beings the characteristics of ourselves they were all there in the seed so it is transmitted trans it was in a unmanifest form when it sprouts and develops you see a gradual manifestation of an unmanifest of a pre-existing unmanifest potential and the tree may die but what what the tree was is again encoded in a seed so it goes back into the unmanifest that's what we say another a simpler example is a Potter he takes clay and molds it into a pot and if he's not satisfied he may push it all back into a featureless lump of clay now one way of looking at it is that the pot was entirely there in the clay every bit of it was there in the clay the Potter just gave it a shape and it when he destroys the shape it's not that the pot is gone the reality called the pot was nothing but the clay and it has gone back to the key the part was pre-existing in the clay in and unmanifest form when you act when you call it apart it's manifest but afterwards when it's again a lump of clay we will say the part is still there in an unmanifest form well thing is unmanifest means you cannot see it hear it smell it taste it touch it you can't take it to Pottery Barn and and and and sell it you can't put water in it or you can't you can't use it so unmanifest means it's not available for transactions but in a potential firm it's there that is the hindu idea of creation the idea of this entire universe it has not come out of nothing it existed in an unmanifest form for the entire universe it's not a seed or a lump of clay rather in Vedanta we call it Maya it existed as Maya the power of God Ishwara Shakti the power of God and then creation started in Sanskrit Shrishti Srishti means projection so what was already there in Maya in a nun manifest form was in Maya this would you or would you have found stars and galaxies and plants and and Vedanta societies and things like that in in mine um none of it neither time nor space not matter not an energy none of it was there but when Srishti starts all of it is projected out and so you have this universe or this physical universe which which we see time space matter energy stars and planets and life and all of that and the idea is one day it will all be destroyed what is destruction what is destruction not complete destruction this whole thing will again go back into its potential form as Maya and then after in a timeless duration duration without time again the projection starts which T so in projection starts unmanifest to manifest stars and planets in a matter and time and space and energy are projected out even now you may call it a big whatever and the entire universe is presented before us and after an immeasurable period of time again it collapses back into again I don't know today you might call it a singularity or something but even beyond that into the unmanifest which is Maya so all beings have their beginning and unmanifest in the middle their manifest what is middle we call it a living being we call it a universe and the end is again unmanifest we call it death we call it the destruction of the universe so this is the idea of creation existence and destruction in Vedanta in sanskrit strictiy sthiti bra layer switched ECT pralaya and the idea in Vedanta is so not only violently in any religion God is said to be the cause of creation the Creator in every religion every theistic religion so what is the idea of of God in in Vedanta Brahman with the power of Maya is the cause of the projection of this universe its sustenance and its eventual reabsorption so from Brahman it emerges in Brahman it exists in inter Brahman it disappears this whole process happens because of Brahmins power called Maya this is the idea another example would be our life every day when we dream we have experience of a dream world the dream world emerges from our mind and we are ourselves there in the dream world it's all an experience projected a virtual reality projected by our minds every night now all the people and the things and the events and the places all of that in the dream world they were there in seed form in our mind it's from our subconscious mind material the mind takes the material and generates a dream world and when we wake up what happens where does the dream world go it disappears back into an unmanifest form within the mind but the seeds are there we can continue to have similar dreams again so this is basically the idea of create destruction in vain Vedanta in Hinduism there is a technical yes hold on to the question there is a technical word for this I have explained it already but I'll let me introduce the term satkaryavada to come in there is enough space yes you come and sit this is called satkaryavada satkaryavada literally means pre-existence of the effect in the form of the cows now we can understand Korea means effect car era means cause and the question is is the effect an entirely new thing or was it existing in some other form earlier the answer given by this theory it's a theory of causation there are different other theories of causation also but this is the theory adopted by many Indian schools including Vedanta which says that the effect pre-existed in the cause so like the if you say the tree pre existed as a potential in the seed the pots all pre existed as possibilities in in clay so the universe pre existed as a potential in Maya so this is called satkaryavada the effect pre-existing as the cause suppose somebody says a beautiful statue is sculpted by a mass master sculptor now in one sense it's the creation of that person's genius but if you look at the material itself every bit of it is there one way of thinking of the of this sculpting is that he just removes the unnecessary parts so an existing sculpture emerges from the from the rock or marble or whatever it is so that's one way of looking at it this is what he has introduced here there were two hands up let's quickly deal with the questions I'll come to you yes this is deep and fundamental a valuer mentioned that book the denial of death Ernest Becker yes it is a deep-rooted fear many people might say no no I'm not afraid of it I don't even think about it ah there is the thing you don't even think about it Ernst Becker who was a very well-known psychoanalyst in his book denial of death he says it's the dominant fear of of our lives especially in the later part of our lives it plays a role and it often plays a subconscious role it drives us so and here's a very interesting take on it now why are we afraid of it well there are many obvious reasons we are first of all we are afraid of way we expect pain and suffering at the time of death Myranda would say that we have gone through many such deaths in the past so that impression is that the terror of that transition is there in our mind so that's what we expect another thing is everything coming to an end who likes that every bit of what we had what we had used to father mother brother sister husband wife friends enemies everything our life coming to an end this body itself it's going to go and what's after that maybe nothing or maybe and complete unknown if I do exist it's an unknown existence or maybe it's devoid it's nothing so terror seizes us in fact you Carl Jung he says that one of the causes of psychopathology in most of my middle-aged patients the central cause is this unspoken fear of death he says it it will it expresses itself as a variety of mental maladies all right yes so this is a general idea which is giving it's not only add weight of a runt Sankey also accepts it now the special spin put on it by advaita vedanta is that when the potter makes a part out of clay that's all that krishna is saying here from the unmanifest it becomes manifest as what as a pot earlier there was no sign of a pot it was just clay now it's clearly a pot so that is called creation more precisely if you want to define it what is creation according to this particular school of indian philosophy satkaryavada from cause to effect creation is the the manifestation of the effect that it takes a certain name and form and you can experience it see it that is called creation now the special spin that advaita vedanta puts on it is advaitha is asking when the potter makes a pot clay into pot has he made something new substance wise is there a new thing are there not two things clay and pot can you numerically count them separately we say no then what is the nature of the pot then it is clay and yet it's not clay something new so then what is new name and farm and use and name four menus in sanskrit nama Rupa Viva Hara is called Maya right the difference is this and it is a lot of discussion they call it a debate between parinama and be worth real transformation versus apparent transformation the Sankhya schools and many of the devotional schools of Vedanta did dualistic schools they say actually Brahman has transformed itself himself or herself into the universe it's an actual transformation and so like milk becomes curd or yogurt and is actually transformed you cannot dare say that it's milk appearing as yogurt if somebody wants a glass of milk and you say here is a cup of yogurt separate I wanted milk oh it is milk didn't you go to the Vedanta class it's it's milk with the name and form of her yahoo no that won't cut the ice it won't in phone - it is yoghurt it has actually been transformed into yoga but I'll come to that but but in the case of what what Vedanta wants to say that the universe is not like that it's not an actual transformation of per element it's more like snake and rope so when the Rope is appearing as the snake it has not actually transformed into the snake it is the rope even when it looks like a snake and when even when you're scared of it it's still just the rope and there's no snake at all only temporarily due to the effect of error we think that it's ignorant and error we think it's a snake we even feel that we saw a snake so that is called waiver the apparent transformation that's what we're on to wants to say and that's why we're on t wants to say that part is nothing more than the clay but the sonken philosopher would say no no the power part is something new you've done actually done that's more closer to our common sense that's not that's the way we mostly think that something new has come up the partner has done something new right Christian mystery yeah the mysteries coming now next verse is going to talk about a mystery right is that what about what you wanted to say we are doing 28 the mystery is coming in 29 29 is all about mystery they let 329 then we are leading into 20 and let's just hear the questions I will not answer them now but here let's see are the questions the what all the universes in Maya Maya is not in the universe the universe is in mind yes yes so that's a question how what was the body did you say how do you get to net neutral a mutual balance it's never going to happen that way Vedanta says the only way you can you can transcend this is by realizing that your Brahman and so you go beyond the realm of karma altogether Swami Vivekananda says good good bad bad and none escaped the law but whosoever wears a farm for means this one wears the chain - what's the chain and of the beginningless chain of cause and effect Karma we just produce this one then what is Vedanta far beyond name and form is Atman ever free no thou art that sannyasi bold and say ohm that's at all if you know yourself as that you are free the chain of cause and effect according to Vedanta it's also illusory knowledge we destroy it completely Ghita also says all Karma's are destroyed by knowledge so how karma can be destroyed by knowledge only possible what is it that knowledge can destroy ignorant and the product of ignorance is never real the snake produced by ignorance is an error a mistake there's no real snake there the dream the all the things that happen in dream it's in an ignorance of our deep of our sleep so they are not real the solution for the dream problem is waking up the solution for the snake problem is the knowledge of the Rope right the solution for samsara problem is not more karma or better karma but waking up to our our real nature having said that in this transactional world what do we do then what are we supposed to do waking up is all well and good but I am unable to wake up now what do I do so Krishna will actually talk about that later on once this topic is concluded the very next topic is karma yoga what do we do these are very powerful forces that we have set in motion we are not aware of that what we are right now is the result of all of that Swami Vivekananda says karma what we are today is the net result of all we have done and thought in the past so what we do now and think now is has a tremendous effect of on what we are going to experience in lives to come so how to deal with that that will come later but if you want a straight answer the real answer wake up wake up to what wake up to your real real nature what you are what is my real nature that's what we talked about but it's also a mystery that's what's going to come now 29th verse it's a very mysterious verse he is summing up the entire teaching is characterizing it as a great mystery if it is so direct why don't I experience it if I am the Atman why don't I know myself as such why do I think I'm a body mind a person if it is everywhere how come I don't see it anywhere if it is all the time why don't I see it any time that's the question and she is the answer or no answer this is 29th worse Australia vodka shot accosted enum Australia WOD pasyati custody nom story of adversity sativa Tania Australia but brother Tita tama-chan Australia China Manya shrine ot Australia of a Yoshino T should to op in impede an achiever cached should lobbying embed an achiever khursheed one sees this self Atman as a wonder mystery if you want to use the word mystery has a wonder another talks of it as a wonder another years of it has a wonder as a mystery and some others again even after hearing about it they don't know it they don't realize it so what does it mean he's basically talking about the extraordinarily subtle nature of the teaching so let's go into this verse what does it mean and remember all the time I'm giving you mostly a non-dualistic interpretation so if you pick up an interpretation of the Gita from a dualistic school from a bhakti school you will get a different take on it alright the first one some see it some person sees this this means the Atman as a wonder as a mystery why is it a wonder or a mystery partially pashyati means sees one sees it thing is this Atman the one which we are trying to understand our real nature is not an object of the senses it is not something that you can see not something though you are using the word see Pasha Pasha means to see but not it also means not just literally see with eyes it also means get an insight to realize to come we use it in English also getting an insight we say oh I see that means oh I understand so partially it's not something that you can actually see with your eyes it's not something that you can hear or or taste or touch it's not also something that one can actually conceive of an and come to an understanding with the mind in say the teachers say indium and Boudicca be shining here it's not an object of the senses it's not an object for the mind of the intellect and therefore it's a mystery something that I can understand not a mystery something that I can see hear smell taste touch not a mystery but something that is there and yet it's beyond my sensory apparatus it's beyond my intellectual capacity then it's a mystery so some see it as a wonder why is it so this Atman see every knowledge in this in our our experience requires three things nor the knowable object and knowledge gotta gain Jana in Sanskrit the knower the knowable object and the knowledge of that object so it is called tripity tripity means the three the three three aspects of epistemology or you can put it this way the knower and the instrument of knowledge and the object of knowledge so you are listening to me you are the knower my words are something that you know and you're using your the whole apparat sensory apparatus of your ears and the mind to know this so there are three here the knower the known and them the instrument of knowledge or knowledge itself whatever you can call it so three putti in the case of Atman none of these three will work first of all it's not an object to be known because why is it not an object because it doesn't exist huh is that true why is it not an object because within what is it it's a subject it's you yourself it's not a thing that you know it is you yourself it is the knower oneself so it cannot be an object of knowledge it is beyond the range of all the instruments of knowledge so the instruments of knowledge do not work there and so one then she at least the nor is there I am there yes it's your very very self so you cannot say that you are the knower of that self in the sense of knowing you know in the sense of in which you see things hear things smell things and this in the sense in which we memorize things understand things in none of these senses are you the knower of the Atman even the enlightened person the person who has become enlightened is realized I am this even that person is not a knower in in this sense in the sense we are normally used to so to put it this way that these three the three putti nor no knowledge or nor known and the instruments of knowledge do not apply here so so it's a mystery therefore it's a mystery but then how is it known is it completely unknown no we don't say that if it was completely unknown then the book would be of no use it can be known but how quite apart from all of this is there any other way of knowing is there any other way of seeing it any other way of realizing it yes the Atman is known by itself it knows itself by itself there's no other way of putting it it's an entirely unique thing nothing else works here let me give you an example in a dark room there is something in a dark room now you take a light and you go there shine the light upon that object maybe it's a book or something and then you can see the object the object is necessary the light is necessary your eyes are necessary all of them are necessary to know that all right so there is an object of knowledge which is separate from me which is not you there are instruments of knowledge the light is a necessary condition your eyes a necessary condition - to be alert all of that and you then know what all are necessary the three are necessary for knowing it now suppose you are in that dark room I ask you how did you know to know that there is a book I sight how did you see it with my own eyes with the help of the light may if I ask you are you there in that dark room yes and there how do you know with what light with what eyes do you know suppose there is no light now can you say that there is a book no I can't see it can you say whether you are there or not yes yes I can say I am there shut your eyes in the dark room no light no eyes close your eyes can you now say whether there is a book or not no can you say are you there will you see and let me open my eyes first let me see no let me switch on the light first no let me ask my friend can you see me am i there no you are continuously revealed to yourself without any effort even that so is that Atman no even that is not there that is the reflected consciousness in the mind that points to the real consciousness that has to be grasped so this gives an indication of what it means of knowing oneself by oneself we do it all the time our own existence is revealed to us by itself then what is the problem the problem is this continuous self revelation that I am doesn't seem to be of much use in fact it is the source of all problems for us because it immediately becomes entangled with body with mind and all the problems of body and mind I am immediately it becomes I am sick oh I am cold winter solstice I saw in a computer haven in the Google is shivering it says winter solstice I am but cold I am poor or I am a student and I have to book there is an exam coming up I am in tension all sorts of problems world problems body problems mind problems relationship problems the I am is entangled the pure I am we have no no sense of that that vedantis go is trying to reveal that to us pelant is trying to show us that the I am is actually not entangled with with with the body mind problems the body mind and its problems anyway that's the project so my point here was if I say the Atman is the true self is known by itself do you get a sense of what is mean meant by knowing something by itself it knows itself by itself this statement is it making some sense to you when I say the way you know yourself in a dark room where you cannot see anything hear anything your eyes are closed yet you absolutely without any doubt you know that you are there that is a that gives you a sense of what is meant here this is said to be this self-knowledge the knowledge of the self there's a word they use in Sanskrit Khurana near apeksha independent of instrument of knowledge there is knowledge which is dependent on the instruments of knowledge what we see depends on eyes what we hear depends on years what we think can remember depends on the mind and memory there are instruments if you think that if you don't agree just ask a person whose memory is failing that person clearly sees that something I am there but it's something within me that's failing it's clearly an instrument memory is an instrument mind is instrument intellect is an instrument you see I'm not as quick as I used to be intellect is an instrument these are all instruments and they deliver knowledge they produce or they Dave generate knowledge for us they operate upon their respective objects were to have been respective objects the eyes operate on form the ears operate on sound the tongue on taste and the nose on smell and so on these are instruments and the knowledge degenerate is born of the action of these instruments without these instruments though that which will not be generated that knowledge depends on these instruments knowledge depends upon its source but the self knowledge the knowledge of the self art Magana is independent of these instruments it may take the help of the instruments you need all these instruments to come to Vedanta class to listen to it anta class to even understand and memorize the verses you need all the instruments but the realization when it comes it comes in the Atman by the Atman you yourself have to intuit your self in your flash you realize this is what I am is it too difficult or is it one to ten one to ten I can't rank it one to ten if you if you ask for ranking the answer is it's a mystery but but you're the second part you asked is how difficult is it is it that we are not trying it deep answer is always it depends how easy is it it's it's the easiest of all things it's continuously available to us it is effortlessly available to us how easy is easy is it it's not at all easy the difficult in terms of the difficulty the difficulty is generated by us it's not that the Atman is there any difficulty in realizing the Atman we have generated the difficulty now it is easily available to us if you sincerely seek for it that's the only answer that kind of I can say so Ramakrishna puts it in bhakti terms vyakulata intense desire to know it a monk once said this and that a sincere seeking must be there you sincerely energetically passionately seek it you will know it it's it's or guaranteed but you'll have to do it nobody else can do it for you up to the last point people can help you well anta class can help you the Guru can help you philosophers can help you your own practices with the instruments can help you remember all practice spiritual practices are done with the instruments if you want to do good deeds you need the body if you want to repeat the name of God you need the mind and and the hands to count the Japan and all of that so all of these you require the instruments all these practices they have their effects but they can't lead you to the ultimate realization they can get you to the very edge where you realize by yourself Atman it says the Atman reveals itself upon whom it has its grace you may wish of renewed a trustee a shabby bruna theatre Nome swamp cut open assured it says who will realize that one will realize to whom the Atman reveals itself Atman means you yourself you will realize it if you if the true you reveals yourself to yourself now in the bhakti schools the interpretation of this is very easy because they will immediately say Bhagwan God whomever God is gracious upon God reveals himself to that that being so it's a direct interpretation which is little difficult for a non duelist to interpret it puts Shankar Acharya in a spot because it says the Atman reveals a little open issue just directly says that is that Atman or God or whatever that to whomever it is it reveals itself to that to whomever it chooses to whomever it chooses it reveals itself in terms of God talk in the talk of these a theistic religion it's pretty easy whomever God chooses will reveal whomever God is gracious so far but in our in the sense of Atman in a non-dualism what will you do whomever it chooses whom does it choose and their Shankar Acharya says this exactly what you pointed out whom does it choose Shankar Acharya writes in his commentary it chooses the one who chooses it the one who seeks it the one who wants it the one who chooses it hold on to your questions let me finish this verse don't forget your questions so reveals itself by itself that's one point that's why it's a wonder because nothing else is like this all this what am i explaining I'm explaining the first word want wonder a stadium Asteria means wonder mystery so I'm all that this file I've been explaining the first word in this verse um this one this one means the ark Muhammad day he is called the indweller in the body we have covered this but it's good to repeat I'll keep repeating so many questions are answered by this framework what is the framework what is the Atman it's the krishna prefers to call it the indweller in the body day he sure eerie the one in this part in the Shara we actually have three bodies according to Vedanta listen no I had just this one I can't manage one now three just imagine the medical insurance don't worry it's not three physical bodies you have one physical body like this one but within this body there is what they rant the calls a subtle body suksham sharir and innermost is what is called a causal body car inertia reader in sanskrit stool a shanira physical body sukshma sharir a subtle body car inertia reader causal body if you want to further details what exactly the physical body we all understand this one the one which dr. ways and examines and pokes and prods that is the physical body the subtle body is when we look inside and we find thoughts feelings desires emotions memories what we call the person I am not accessible to the doctor not accessible to your physician know isn't it so which instrument can discover your your whether you prefer cappuccino or latte which instrument they can add the most scan some parts of your brain and find some corresponding neuronal activity but your desire itself your thoughts your beliefs the actual X first person experience are having which instrument nothing at the most they can go to the brain and see some activity there so that subtle bodies is the thoughts feelings emotions ideas what we feel inside that is the subtle body if you go beyond that beyond that means in your inner experience you will hit a blank wall nothing what else is that beyond that if you dismiss the physical body suppose you have no sensation of the body you hear nothing see nothing smell nothing tastes nothing touch nothing you remember nothing you do not talk internally you do not desire anything hate anything I do not I'm not trying to understand anything look for anything stop it's a blankness that blankness is called the causal body the Atman is Beyond it helps to think of it as encased though it's not encased in that sense but it's it's a first step think of it as other than other rely is not this body is not even the person it's a big step most of us are sort of irrevocably committed to the idea that I am a person in a body not even the person not even the blankness blankness which ensues when you dismiss the person intellectually beyond that is the Atman that's what Krishna is trying to point out so these three bodies further detail if you want further detail the physical bodies Tula sharira is composed of is is what is called the uneme Akasha the made of the food and drink that we have eaten converted into physical body the subtle body has three components mono pranamaya kosha manomaya kosha big annamaya kosha the vital sheet the mental sheet and the sheath of the intellect that is the subtle body and the causal body is called anandamaya kosha the the sheet of bliss why we will not go into it today if you want further detail go further into and see you know turn up the resolution of the microscope what are these the subtle body what is it made of further physical we know the doctors have tremendous knowledge of the physical body down to cellular and intracellular level the subtle body if you look pranamaya kosha manomaya kosha big annamaya kosha further if you look closer it reveals itself as 19 parts so in Vedanta 19 parts the way Vedanta understands it the five sense organs the five are not the physical part of it the powers activities the functions of this organs five sense organs the five motor organs the five Puranas they called pancha prana the vital activity the physiological prana five planners and Manabu digital ankara mind intellect memory and ego nineteen parts five plus five plus five plus for this these are the three bodies and Wyndham what am I trying to explain here the word aina means this this what this self this self is not any of these it is the dweller in this three body system this triple body system apart from physical body apart from subtle body apart from a causal body there is a reality the witness consciousness that is the Atman hence hence it's a mystery he's still explaining the first word mystery why is it a mystery there are any number of mysteries in the physical body we are still plumb being the complexity and the Marvel of the physical body the mysteries become even more difficult in the subtle body and causal body beyond our thinking we don't even it's not even in ordinary discourse but Atman is beyond that hence a mystery so who can realize it he says gosh it a rare one a rare one who is that rare one here it refers to the qualified seeker so Vedanta is a system a list of qualities which are required do you remember them the fourfold qualification we wake up the analysis between the eternal and on eternal Vairagya dispassion for the non-eternal the six for treasure calmness of mine Shama control of the senses dama titiksa a spiritual forbearance operati we drawl from messing around with the world too much then Samad on a settling down in our vedantic pursuit and shut her affirmed faith that there is something in this I will realize it six for treasure and finally the fourth one moksha from an intense desire for freedom so we must have plenty of fuel in all of these four engines to propel us to this realization now he says crushed it only a rare one has all these qualities that's why it becomes difficult don't be discouraged we all have it to some extent you all have it to some extent otherwise you won't be sitting here today on on a Friday evening why waste a perfect Friday evening you know before a weekend in Manhattan that too and come and listen to a 5,000 year old philosophy because there isn't spiritual inquiry because there's a spiritual thirst when these qualifications are rattled off people tend to get rattled maybe it's not for me maybe I'm never going to do it somebody asked Ramana Maharshi you know he of the who am i same somebody asked am I qualified to realize this truth because if you look at all this you feel discouraged am I qualified to realize become enlightened am I qualified and Ramana Maharshi said did you see I because the method is the whole project is Who am I if you say I you're qualified because you have an eye to investigate you're qualified so we are we have all gotten a high to envy I have the self we are that after all we are that of course we are qualified but we have to work on it okay next comes another mystery our story of adversity today watch anya another one teaches it it's it's a mystery to see it itself to realize itself it's a mystery to teach it is another mystery is it a mystery almost a lot of time this verse is a mysterious words what why is it a mystery to teach it omnia means the other other here means that the teacher the teacher for the teacher this is a special problem because it is beyond language beyond conception that which is beyond language how can you speak it whether they mean speaks teachers Vedanta teachers about the Atman Krishna is teaching Arjuna with what with words what is the vehicle of teaching what is the vehicle of communication words language and yet you have clearly defined the Atman as something beyond words then how do you do it mystery in the Kano opposition there is a beautiful point where the teacher is about to teach the student has gone to the teacher now with MonaVie gianni mota heated anusha shot the teacher says we do not know it we we do not know it the Atman you are seeking the teacher says we do not know it nor do we know how to teach it can you teach us enlightenment about the self self knowledge of Vedanta the teacher says we do not know how it can be taught well at least you are enlightened right am I wrong on that count it says you know it right teacher says we do not know it also so before the student gets up and storms out having been wasted an afternoon maybe going to the teacher she teaches is hold on there is a way and it's a way taught to us by our by the ancient masters by which the lineage of masters have attained enlightenment age after age I can try it on you and see if it works and the language there in the is no no Nava Yanni more tighter than Lucia she odd it is resumed approve a champion a stud which a secretary hence we have heard from the ancient ones who have taught us in this way what is the way let me try it hold on to the question let me try it we can try it right now see if it works on you it can't be expressed it can't be known now you know why it cannot be known we already discussed it it cannot be known as an object but you can lead a person to enlightenment let's try it how the cane open is shed the teacher says this is how we were taught by ancient once it worked for us let's see if it works for you all right what is it an ear David very Todd a toe of edita that he you want to know the Atman yes it is other than that Atman is other than anything that you know whatever you know you know all of us we know something whatever we know what we have read hurts tasted touched smelt what we have conceived of what whatever we know in life till today it's not the Atma oh so it's an unknown it is beyond all that is unknown also whatever remains for you to know whatever is in the universe which you do not know see it cleanly divides into two things mutually exclusive sets at this moment one is something that you know all that you know you can put it all that you believe know hear everything and there is a huge circle I think it's Einstein who said that see of the unknown you know it's like like little island that we know and it's surrounded by a sea of unknown so here's a vast sea of unknown Atman is not what you know and that unknown thing Atman is not there also it's not an unknown thing it's not a known thing then what is it what is the only thing that is not known not unknown I let me make it even more clear all things in this universe can be divided into two for each of us things you know things you do not know what is the one one reality which does not fall in the things you know any things that you do not know you the knower the nor among the nobles there are two kinds the known and the unknown right now for you for every one of us but apart from the known apart from the unknown there is the knower did it work are you enlightened you are laughing if you are not enlightened then we need further detail could you could you explain it to us little further that sounds interesting eighteen chapters bhagavad-gita 700 verses yes question yes yes so Dakshinamoorthy stotram talks about it's a beautiful hymn composed by Adi Shankaracharya Dakshinamoorthy is the south facing shiva the the iconography is shiva as teacher one who teaches Brahma Gianna the knowledge of Atman enlightenment and faces south and has this posture this is called a mudra chin mudra you know this chain mudra now you can understand these three these three are the three bodies physical body subtle body causal body three bodies this is the Atman this is the I instead of identifying with these three you take it and identify it with the Atman that is enlightenment chin mudra chin mudra chin means consciousness actually it's exactly the process is embodied in this this is the whole teaching it's very interesting also it's something that is common to all human beings and some of the higher Apes it is called the opposable thumb it enables civilization to because of this we have civilization actually there are animals who can't do this they have paws like this only human beings and some other creatures are there this enables us to use tools opposable thumb also another thing you will notice anybody in the world we need it need not distance science of mudras is a vast thing anybody in the world who does not even know this anybody who's trying to convey something to other I have I have something interesting to tell you it's and convey not in the sense of gossip convey in a sense a fan of a subtle idea or realization and insight they will do this I mean noticed you'll notice this is what I want to tell you they do this automatically it doesn't have to be Abaddon toward option about anything like that it's something psychological so these these is a different subject it's a vast subject called budros mudras means the wave you place your hands and the fingers the different postures and they have meanings symbolic meanings and they have effect on your mind so when you meditate we put our hands like this chin would drop side down like this there are other mudra this is one mudra this is one mudra and there are you use them in in poojas they have immediate effect on the on the mind this is one mudra this is another mudra so all of these are different mantras and they have different meanings and the different effects on the person who does it and this was a very ancient I would say a science in itself of which we only have the vestiges left all right yes quickly spiritual document spiritual document in a sense book he well if you look at the gospel of sri ramakrishna cat amrita you will find he refers to gita he he recommends the gita strongly in bengali is Geeta Kukui Gita korvac Geeta is a very good book read the Gita he speaks very favorably about Atma Ramayana and about Vedantic scriptures whenever they were mentioned he would actually fold his hands and bow his head about the Upanishads and the Gita - also where does anyway the hymn was chanted many other scriptures come into the story of Sri Ramakrishna for example some bhakti texts are there bhagavata smen shinned then ashtavakra is something that he valued was a very radical non-dualistic text also remember he was not particularly textual himself he was critical of pundits who who are masters of the text and yet were not enlightened we are going to come to that now why after all of this is still not enlightened we'll see so these are some of the texts which come up in in the story of Sri Ramakrishna now the question remains so it cannot be expressed by speech and why cannot not count it can it not be today I'll just leave you with this why can it not be expressed by speech and how do the teachers manage to teach it with which makes it a wonder why it cannot be expressed by speech that I have a talk you should look up on YouTube paradox of language add weight of a rant and the paradox of language is Atman Brahman why is it beyond language and if it is beyond language then how do you express it through language because Gita is language Upanishads are language all the texts are language so there are strategies which involved if you're interested I can take it up next time and alright we could spend some time on it next time also let me complete the verse will revert back to that point next time and before we go ahead so that's makes it a mystery because everything else can be expressed by language this cannot be expressed by language and yet the teacher has to express it by language hence a mystery another point the teacher also has to be extraordinary the qualifications of the teacher I just mentioned it here open he should say shreya Akiyama hata Brahman Easter shreya means well-versed in Vedanta a car Mahuta means literally not not damaged or injured by desire that the teacher must not have any kind of worldly desire yes teacher has a desire that you become enlightened that's all right but the teacher should not have any otherworldly expectation from a student you here you are making donations but the traditional Vedanta School in ancient times if the teacher who had to pay for you so actually I should pay for you to stay study all your stay and study and everything is free so if you stand and then after you are finished then when you leave when you you give something for thee it's called guru Dakshina so that was the idea guru Dakshina means an offering to the teacher and that's why these ashrams were maintained by donations from kings and now and in those days we don t teachers had the same problem today looking for donations and grants because we find one of the greatest discussions on vedanta and the brethren iccup initial very yog Ghia valkia the great master of a rant that goes to the emperor the king janaka and the king says have you come for donations which means he had been coming pretty often for donations literally says cows in those discover the wealth have you come for cows or do you want to have a discussion on philosophy and Yaakov Alka says both one of and there's a disguise it's a fantastic piece Briony competition one of the most ancient the most ancient available Upanishads and I'm extra discussion one of our Swami's in New Delhi is going with the file to a central government office there to get grants for the ashram and and the officer to whom he had gone approached Swami have you come for her money or for discussion about Brockman and Swami says both and then he came and told us the story we want to discuss philosophy or they have to come here for money well actually the officer said so I mean the money we will give you talk about something good in Suri for a change there not just how much money you need that was the discussion so the teacher Akiyama hatov should not have any worldly desire and finally Brahmin Ishta must be established in brahman best is if it the teachers enlightened but how do you know the teachers enlightened how many enlightened teachers will you get so established in Brahman means the one who is whose life is dedicated to Brahman not a part-time Vedanta teacher at the very least this person must be must be a serious seeker of Brahman completely dedicated to the to cultivating Vedanta and seeking enlightenment so Brahman Easter means established in Brahman it is Sanskrit word nishta in Indian languages also it's there so these are the three qualifications of the teacher that is what is meant by the teacher is also unique the student has the qualifications you remember fourfold qualification and the teacher also has these qualifications I'll end with a story so we couldn't complete this verse we'll do it next time I'll end with a story of how Lata Maharaja Swami at boot ananda who had no formal education to speak of he is called one of the miracles of sri ramakrishna he attained enlightenment brahma gana now he saw his brother monks Vivekanand and others studying Vedanta studying philosophy Vedanta history so many things and Lattimer had said why all this this is not necessary for enlightenment our master showed us the direct path to enlightenment all this study so many books not necessary and then he himself says later on there is true you all needed because you are going to be teachers of of humanity so as teachers you need all of this Sri Ramakrishna's to say rather grew some example to kill yourself don't do to kill yourself you just one need just a nail a nail but to to fight with the enemy you need a sword and a shield what he meant by that is self-realization just for yourself is not so difficult simple teachings are enough I mean the teacher says other than the known other than the unknown enough if you follow that up Rama Rama she says Who am I follow that up it's enough but if you have to convey this teaching to others and many others of different temporal temperaments different backgrounds so you need a wide range of learning and command over over these this philosophy and different philosophies so the teacher is also unique because the one who teaches this mystery Shanti Shanti Shanti hurry he that sat sri ramakrishna aparna must