Video 10

10. Bhagavad Gita I Chapter 2 Verses 26-27 I Swami Sarvapriyananda

Oh Vasudeva Suton daivam comes a charnel demurred annum Devaki paramanandam krishnam vande a jagadguru so in the bhagavad-gita we are studying the second chapter and Sri Krishna has just given the essential teaching about the Atman the Atman means the self as what is our real nature Vedanta in that sense is very simple it says that we do not truly know what we are what is there here we think it's a body mind but it's something far more than that far deeper than that I like that saying that what is behind you and what is yet in front of you is as nothing compared to what is within you what is behind you all your past what is yet ahead of you whatever is going to happen in life we think these are the important things my past and my future that's what's important none of that is anything compared to its its insignificant compared to what is within you what is within us it has nothing compared to what is within within us I think I must have told this joke earlier it happened a year before last in Santa Barbara I had quoted this thing more than once and so somebody left a card in the ashram saying that and the card itself says the top of the card it was not handwritten just printed what is behind you and what is ahead of you is as nothing compared to what is within you and inside the card it says and what is within the freezer so we rushed and saw the in the freezer somebody had left ice cream in the freezer but the admin the doctrine of the admin is that if we would truly know what we are then all our problems would be solved we are trying to solve the problems in a worldly way but the real solution is a spiritual solution and that spiritual solution is a knowledge of what I am what am i what what did we learn shri krishna said from verses 12 onwards first of all most important again and again sri krishna has been saying this you are immortal you are not born with the birth of the body you do not die with the death of the body nithya Avinashi indestructible he said weapons cannot cleave it the water cannot drown it and fire cannot burn it it means the Atman you the self indestructible immortal then we saw that other verse sixteen twists which says NASA toe with deity Hara a very profound verse which implies not only are you eternal immortal but this reality which you are is the only reality of the universe the Atman is real the UH not man is an appearance the self is the reality of which the not self not self other than you whatever you experience is an appearance of yourself you are the reality of this universe don't feel all that happy by you I don't mean you the person the spiritual reality which is our common spiritual heritage that's what I mean sometimes I feel people like Vedanta classes because it keeps saying nice and cool things about you but remember the you who they've talked about here is the spiritual you the spiritual self then one more thing we learned here was serve a guitar all pervading it's not that we are separate little bits of consciousness in each body and mind that's what it feels like because we are localized in bodies and minds we think I am separate you are separate each separate and she is separate no it's a survey it is one all-pervading reality in that in that oneness many the plural universe appears like a dream universe it's one mind the dreamers mind is one person dreaming but in the dream you will find an entire world then what else did we learn we learned up rummy it is not an object of any pramana of the sources of knowledge you can't see it hear it smell it taste it touch it it cannot be inferred by by the mind and so on it's not an object to these sources of knowledge up coming up it is not a doer not an experiencer of the results of action in sanskrit occur table jota and we did all this and then now we are on 26th verse here sri krishna some sub d teaching by the way of summation he says he acknowledges how difficult it is if you really think about it it's stunning we think the other body shows us you're not the body we think the hardest person in the body you are not this person you are not denying that it's there but you are not it and it says you are an infinite immortal spiritual being consciousness itself being itself the absolute so it's some tremendous fact somebody said actually it's easier to believe in God and to believe this it's about you but still it's so difficult to believe this about myself I can still believe that there must be some kind of God but this is so much so tremendous and yet it is you and it can be realized not a matter of just belief definitely not we Dante aims to educate us to show us how this is true last week the University of Michigan there was a symposium on Advaita Vedanta and education ancient wisdom and modern education I think they put up the videos on you can see so I gave a talk about this very same thing about knowing oneself but you see shankara's Advaita Vedanta is a pedagogy is a methodology of teaching it's a way to show us a truth about ourselves or not one way many ways out there but basically to show us so that we have this insight that aha moment this is what I am then all your problems are solved not externally everything that is there externally will continue but it's no longer of any consequence to you you are set free so that's the goal of Vedanta now it's very difficult difficult to believe first of all and then to make the breakthrough difficult even to take seriously so Sri Krishna he says it's quite possible that you don't believe any of it he thinks through these things that Arjuna probably is not getting it you know good teachers you might think they are like mind reader's you don't have to be if you have taught in school in a specially grade school or kindergarten one look into the faces of the kids and you know whether they're listening whether they get it or they're thinking of something else it's very easy if you have been teaching for a long time you don't have to be a telepath I remember one of the finest teachers I ever met he's a great scholar of Vedanta and he's a professor of physics too it's a very formidable his name is K Rama subrahmanyam he's an IIT Mumbai but one thing I liked about his teaching was I attended some of his classes as a young monk he was trained under under the string Adi Shankaracharya directly so he was teaching us an abstruse text of Vedanta and I still remember what was startling about his teaching was he was absolutely he knew what you were thinking and one disconcerting habit he had was he would walk around speaking his classes were very interesting long classes but he had to you had to be hyper alert because the moment you were not alert he would notice he's this tall thin man with blazing eyes he would notice and focus those that pair of blazing eyes on you and he would rush towards you literally and say yes tell me what I said I'll ask a question related to what he was saying ask a question related to what he was saying he just point to you yes so I've had my share of tough teachers there's one teacher a very great scholar I had heard about his it was inconvenient for me to go from the monestery to attend his classes but I had heard about it so I went to attend one class of his and it's a very small group of students but all the students are they of all degrees in Sanskrit or Indian philosophy they are retired teachers people like that so they're all sitting there and I I noticed why he has this stuff reputation this great scholar I'm not talking about Ram subramanyam now I'm talking about somebody else so he starts off the class with the 10-minute scolding he starts off by saying I don't know why I bother to come here and look at your faces and I know you don't understand anything it's a shame I tell you it's a shame so ten minutes we all said like this but I realized it was like par for course he would do that every time so they sort of take it in stride and he would treat them like little I mean you can't treat little children like that nowadays they are in the 60s or 70s the students and he would ask a question you would have to stand up to answer it and he won't let you sit down until you haven't answered it he'll help you this lady as she stood up to answer a question and he kept on saying I won't let you sit down till you give me the answer and she was giggling but at least he didn't make this student stand up on the bench holding the years or something like that so tough teachers Krishna is like that he immediately sees Arjuna's not getting it it's it's it's understandable so he says twenty-sixth first touch I know nityam touch I need to Adam nityam Manya same rhythm nityam Manya same rhythm Tatar pita muhabba Tatar pita maha-baho naive emoji Tamar Hersey naive emoji Tamar her see what does it mean if however however means in spite of all these Vedantic teaching if however you think that it the self you you are born with the birth of the body and you die with the death of the body even then o mighty-armed one you ought not to grieve for it what is he doing he is taking a different stance now he's coming down a couple of steps as it where instead of talking about an immortal consciousness the one reality of the universe beyond all senses are all sources of knowledge a transcendent non-actor non experiencing awareness instead of talking of that he says just as you know yourself right now you think if you think that you are born people are born with the birth of the body and people die with the death of the body the self is comes up with the birth of the body and the self dies with the death of the body even then you you should not be shaken by this by death why not we'll come to that but before that it's interesting to think what point of view is this what point of view is this there are different candidates I'll give you two which I have heard and I'll tell you what I think one is the materialist that's the most common point of view said today for example and all throughout history in every civilization including the ancient Vedic civilization there have been materialists who say all this is nonsense body is all that exists matter is all that exists and they are living matter we are born and in this body we exist and then the body goes we are finished that's it there's nothing before this do nothing after this as far as you are concerned the self is concerned admin the admin is nothing but the body so this view was called the view of the charvaka charvaka the ancient Indian materialists literally the Sanskrit word charvaka comes from Charu waka sweet talk sweet talk means it's a most acceptable easy kind of philosophy was so what was their recommendation since you are born with the birth of the body and you die with the death of the body make use of the time you have got eat drink and be merry so there's an Indian version to that many people we have heard of it yabba debate so come debate renowned click logarithm pivot must meet Buddha Sudhir has opener aghanim Kota with their verses there are verses of these ancient materialists what do they recommend as long as you live as long as the body lives live happily how do you live happily what is the recommendation rhythm privet this is difficult to translate it literally means drink a lot of ghee now today's closest would be you drink lots of Pepsi or coke or something like that you know like have fun just indulge yourself but it is expensive where do I get the money is renowned with drug borrow money credit economy your credit cards maxed out your credit cards but but but I have to pay back then this is no you don't have to pay back Reena must be with us today inertia Pune Raghava nama kusa when the body is burnt when you die the body is burnt you're not going to come back anymore nobody is going to catch you it is the universe is the ultimate free lunch I have fun what about my kids or bommai they'll have to pay who hates that's their problem we may think that's ridiculous but that's actually mostly what we are doing there economists they've talked about the price to be paid by future generations if you consume a lot now the prices in terms of debt in terms of global warming in Terps terms of resource depletion in terms of pollution all that will actually have to be paid but who will pay it children grandchildren great-grandchildren if any are left after a few generations some people say it's only 30 years now that might be too alarmist but so that is the materialist point of view materialist point of view and sweet that's a very nice kind of philosophy have fun while it lasts the problem is according to all other schools of philosophy not just we're on every other school of thought in ancient India except the materialist not only the world will last but you will also last and therefore what you do now you'll have to pay the price for that it's not that you get off scot-free you will have to pay the price for that so it doesn't really work ultimately that kind of philosophy and it's short-sighted because the pleasures which we try to enjoy right now not caring about what we have to pay those pleasures are momentary and they have passed away we still remember and the price is still there yes yes you're right the question is being asked what do you mean by way the men used to talk about Vedanta is the generic term or a specific school of thought both there is specifically when I'm explaining the bhagavad-gita or in fact any other scripture the Upanishads bhagavad-gita Brahma sutras whatever it is or the texts which we are studying the Manduca karika upper auction of booty I am referring to a particular school of the Daunte which is Advaita Vedanta non-dual Vedanta Shankar Acharya so it's an ancient school it's actually the traditionalists will be annoyed if I say to non-dual Vedanta Shankar Acharya Shankar Acharya in the tradition is called Bosh Chikara the great commentator but the texts of the school and the school itself predates Shankar Acharya by centuries if not millennia so that's the school I'm referring to and there's a reason why I'm referring to that school because that's the philosophical foundation of the order I belong to the Ramakrishna order but also having said that there are many other schools of Iran there is vashisht at the weight of Ramanuja there is the greater the dualistic school of mantra there's ad weighted weight of nimbarka acharya there is the should hard waiter of vallabhacharya there is the agility of Veda wait whose descendants are the Hare Krishnas so so there are there's a whole series of scuba antic schools now one thing which swami vivekananda and the early Swami's did when they came here they presented the combined spiritual heritage of India as Vedanta so for example this is the Vedanta Society of New York but the first publication which came out from your very famous Swami Vivekananda's Raja yoga but it's actually a commentary on the Patanjali yoga sutras which is the yoga school of philosophy which is distinct from the Vedanta so it's not even a school of Vedanta so the entire the the the philosophy of meditation the bhakti schools and the Guayana schools all of them were taught by the early Swami's and the general name was Vedanta there is nothing wrong in that because if you go back to India also and if you look at Hinduism modern Hinduism you will find most of the practicing Hindus their philosophical origins lie in some school of the and the other nyaya vaisheshika the school of ancient school the logicians are the Sankhya school or the yoga school of Patanjali these are more theoretical academic now than actually practiced people practice them but as their but if you ask them there are scholars of Naya for example logic but if you ask actually ask the scholar of jnana in India today what what are you practicing are you practicing the new ayah sutras of Gautama in your day to day no no no he'll probably turn out to be a devotee of Krishna or something like that so those the Shri Vaishnava the Madras in Karnataka the even say for example the swaminarayan sect in of Gujarat now all over the world or the push T Marga in in Gujarat again the different schools the ISKCON the Hari Krishna so all of these are the modern phase of Hinduism if you probe if you probe you will come across some school of Vedanta as the basis so in a general term Vedanta means the spiritual heritage of India today the philosophical foundations of modern Hinduism but if you say specifically I would like to pin you down to one school then clearly it is the Advaita Vedanta Shankara but not in an exclusive sense you can do that in an exclusive sense like totapuri the Guru of Shri Ramakrishna only at the way the Vedanta nothing else so we don't do that does that answer your question but it gave rise to two more questions I'm coming to you you first and then then she can ask yes there is but I'm not qualified it's a very deep subject it's related to Tantra I didn't mention Tantra Tantra is an entirely autonomous I would say school in Hinduism with lot of followers and there are many schools of Tantra so sri vidhyaa is a particular ritual a bit of philosophy associated with it I really don't know enough about it to say anything more there are you have to be initiated into it formally by a guru to practice it yes lady here yes all right I'll repeat the question is a good question that a bit about a Vashisht adwaita and Advaita mr. data's the qualified monism associated with ramanujacharya and the shri wash novice and advaita vedanta non-dual vedanta she asks is that the impression she has is that vashisht advaitha is more devotional more ta stickpin advaita vedanta you're right there's a lot to be said about this is a vast history nearly a thousand years of dialectics and many many texts written on both sides Ramanuja who came about 200 years after Shankara 250 years after Shankara he gave a new set of commentaries on the Upanishads and the bhagavad-gita and the Brahma sutras he did not write separate commentaries and Upanishads but he wrote a separate commentary on the bago on the Brahma sutras called srivasa and a commentary on the bhagavad-gita giving a different interpretation from Advaita Vedanta the core difference is this fellow I will not go into it because it's a it's a huge sub F a Sanae ting subject I have a book written by Vasudeva Shastri of Yonker called Advaita mother the delight of non-dualism that's the name of the book this was a great pundit in the last century at two centuries ago last century in fact and he was a non duelist but he was reading qualified monism so seriously studying it here's other scholarly friend pundits they teased him are you becoming a qualified non duelist qualified monist registered wait are you moving away from non-dualism so this color of Yonker he said no I'm just studying it and to prove that he was still a loyal non duelist he wrote this book in which he points out thirty thirty differences no twenty two differences I think twenty two differences between non-dualism and vicious turn a qualified monism the two system so there there are many differences Ramanuja who wrote the commentaries on Gita and Ramayan in his brahma sutra commentary he starts by sea you have touched upon a favorite subject of mine so I'm finding it difficult to stop but I just mentioned this two things and then stop one is he starts his commentary on the Brahma sutras with a tremendous attack on shankara's non-dualism he calls shankara's non-dualism the great opponent the english ism is mild the Sanskrit is more weighty maha boowa Buxa the great upon opposing force or opponent and he levels page after page the first part of the commentary on the first Sutra is a powerful attack and a good attack it is said that sometimes you know when people do dialectics creat criticize each other's positions they cut down a straw man they set up a straw man and shoot it down something misrepresent your position will represent your position in the silly way and then it makes it easy to dismiss but Rama no she doesn't do that but Rama no she does is he gives a faithful rendering an acceptable rendering of non-dualism of Shankaracharya and then proceeds to cut it down mercilessly in fact it is said among scholars I've heard Ramanuja who attacks Shankara non-dualism the the method of attacking in ancient India the debate was called wadda wadda means debate one of the rules of wada was if I'm going to attack you to criticize your position first I must state your position to your satisfaction or the beautiful rule you see it would prevent so many quarrels normally when we are arguing against somebody we are not really listening to the other person we are thinking of our answer to that I'm getting an answer ready I'll give you such an answer what you are saying I'm not listening but here it forces you what did that person say and you have to repeat back what that person said to that person satisfaction so this is what you said one two three four five six seven eight yes now I'm permitted to give a reply what a beautiful thing it can prevent corals from philosophers to the household to boss and in the corporate sector wherever anyway it is said Ramanuja presented at the weight of a rant the so fairly in his introduction in his before starting his criticism of Advaita Vedanta that a newcomer to Advaita Vedanta can actually learn at the way the Vedanta from that it's such a fair presentation a great scholar of non-dualism Shankara Vedanta who is no friend of qualified monists he said to me Ramanuja is a gentleman but a thousand years of dialectics one of the great Ramanuja dialectician s' was Vedanta daesik I think he wrote shatter dushanyi a hundred objections against Advaita Vedanta and I'm a hundred years after that or two hundred years after that another scholar wrote shut ablution ii a hundred ornaments of advaitha that means refuting 100 objections and so on this is the one thing I wanted to say this is a very vast background but more coming to your point vashisht advaitha is definitely more theistic instead of saying I am Brahman it says I am a part of Rahman Brahman is the whole of which all of us we are parts so the world is a part of Brahman you and I we are parts of Brahman and what you have to do knowledge is helpful to realize that we are a part of Brahman I am a part of Brahman that is knowledge now I depart what will be my relation to the whole knowledge or devotion devotion you are a tiny part of the whole so your relation to the whole will be a devotion God is the whole Brahman is the whole and Brahman in ramanuja's view is saguna brahman brahman with infinite auspicious qualities if you get rahman who just started on the qualities of God then you have to have patience because he'll take a full page once he starts what are the all-knowing all merciful all loving just beautiful gracious and he'll go on and on and on in fact the Bhagavad Gita Rahman who just come into you and bhagawad gita he starts off the first page is one line one single sentence of the qualities of God he loses himself in ecstasy when he talks about God but it is a theistic God not pure consciousness pure being beyond the universe you know I am Brahman is the only reality the universe is an appearance and I am Brahman Ramanuja would would plug his ears it's blasphemy for him to hear such things so it's a very very very devotional philosophy yeah sorry for that little lecture in fact if you want to have a deeper understanding of Advaita Vedanta the original classical Advaita Vedanta it's good to study mr. Drouet also because they are often confused together the clad the difference will make you understand both very clearly the approaches are very because they sound similar but they are not similar yes of course there is but it's a different approach altogether in adwaita vedanta the question was do we have bhakti-yoga and undo it away Dante yes but what what does bhakti-yoga serve in advaitha Vedanta twofold one is at the preparatory stage it is a very good preparation for knowledge bhakti is a support for knowledge what will set you free what is the ultimate bhakti or Jana the Shankara will say obviously Jana there's no question knowledge will set you free I am Brahman and after becoming free after becoming an enlightened person when you again find yourself as an appearance as an individual and appearance the God is also an appearance to you that individual in appearance can have devotion to God in appearance their work T is an expression of knowledge I know you and I vow and I are we are one but still I am the devotee and you are my lord it's a very beautiful attitude Hanuman he says Sri naughty John Oakey naughty of Hara paramaatma nee tatar p mama service service for Sri Rama Kamala luciana he says I know vishnu saguna brahman Sri nota and Janaki not the Ramachandra husband of Sita they are one reality Abhay the Parramatta money and if you look at it up do it in an unrealistic mid and we are all one reality we know that I know that but even so to therapy even so for me everything is the lotus-eyed Rama that's that's an expression of devotion of love that can exist after full knowledge also so Shankar Acharya has no problem is not playing becoming a duelist by writing all these beautiful hymns to - Krishna - Ganga - Shiva beautiful hymns some of the most beautiful insulated by Shankar Acharya who is a non duelist and he's not playing two roles there that devotion is an expression of his knowledge there is a very beautiful saying and I don't know who it is attributed to the the roles of bhakti and gana knowledge and devotion both hot prog do item ohia before enlightenment duality leads to some saw a delusion we get trapped which we call samsara this this problem we have it is because of plurality duality property money Shia dr. Kunkel padam do item ad rated episode in Durham after you become enlightened one Brahman I alone am that after that again when this world appears to you as it will and you find yourself in this body and you're living the same life as before then what do you do how do you live life in a false world how do you live life after having known the reality but your thumb culprit um - item duality culprit um imagined or projected for the sake of love is more beautiful than non duality Advaita the prisoner but who can say that only the person who is realized non duality so it's a it's a difference I and the Lord are different it's your projection you know that you are not different you are one we have already realized it now it's a matter of delight what do you do when you watch a movie you know it's not real you know there's nothing to it but then you project a certain reality to it and then you react you laugh and you cry and you cheer and you clap all the while knowing the background is that it's a movie then delight comes otherwise teller you see King Kong climbing Empire State Building iconic figure the picture you know and you say oh oh it's so enjoyable and watching the movie theater King Kong this huge creature is climbing Empire State Building and and if a tiny monkey comes in the theater you'll scream and run away why because King Kong is an appearance not there and therefore you enjoy but that monkeys there can bite so delight it becomes a delight after non-dual realization mother Susan Saraswathi who was a great non duelist in fact up the Acme of philosophical writing and non-dualism adwaita City one of the toughest books on non-dualism which is and replied to an attack by duelists written by mother Susan Saraswathi master I I myself once learned the new Navi Ania the new school of the School of neurologic which originated in Bengal I learned that I meant and we had each had to stand up and say why you are learning it so I said you are a monk why are you learning new logic so I said I'm learning it to read Medusa then saraswathi's Advaita simply yeah so Advaita City toughest book on non-dualism Medusa's and Saraswathi but the same mother Susan Saraswathi has written a beautiful commentary on the bhagavad-gita and in one of the verses he says I forget the original Sanskrit what it means is this if the yogi in meditation wants to Rimmer a remain immersed in thee in the light shining in his ha in his heart the unmanifest light of consciousness shining in his heart wants to remain immersed in that let him do so but what delights my mine eyes what delights mine eyes is the little blue boy playing on the bank of Yamuna Krishnan the baby Krishna playing on the banks of Yamuna who is saying this mother Susan soliciting non dualist so bhakti is very much possible but the philosophy of Mukti in shankara's advaitha and the philosophy of bhakti in ramanuja's resisted do it different and in rama rogers register do it a bhakti is the supreme in fact the bhakti reaches its peak in what is called property property is complete surrender yeah so there's a lot of discussion about that in so you if you are interested in practice of bhakti there many things to be learned from ramanuja's I'll take this occasion to share one thing in the Gita itself in this second chapter one more insight beautiful inside which Ramanuja gives which you won't find here in the indian on dualist interpretation Ramanuja says in it will come in the gita little later control of the senses is necessary for enlightenment it says give Krishna himself will again and again emphasize strict self-control is necessary for enlightenment and then he says it's only after enlightenment that perfect sense control is possible Rama Raja catches that in his commentary he says isn't it a vicious cycle you want control over the senses and a controlled body controlled mind so that you get enlightenment but that will not happen until you are you are enlightened and since one depends on the other enlightenment is impossible he says Duch prapya it is impossible to get then then what do you do then Ramanujan says that is why bhakti is introduced moment you direct love towards God the senses are automatically controlled it's much easier to control even when you're not enlightened if music is spiritual music you want to smell nice things flowers and incense for God want to eat nice things Alfred Prasad everything is connected to God our actions are connected to God our senses are connected to God our activities and thoughts are connected to and God in fact the very word Krishna means that attracted the one who attracts the one who attracts our senses once you try a little bit you would find a tremendous attraction in attraction of devotion of love to God and then the senses become much easier to control because they are not flowing Godward those senses are that they have no problem they're a spiritual life becomes much easier okay last question I will not answer it maybe but let's hear the question you raised your hand yes yes yes yes right yes well that's why I said he's asking about the song Raja Govinda which is very popular but yoga Windham literally means if we translate into English what ship Govinda or Krishna that's why I said some of the most beautiful dualist beautiful devotional hymns have been composed by Shankar Acharya but now you know that you two to judge a philosopher a saint philosopher like Shankar Acharya you must take the entire body of his world you can't take a little from here many people take only the hymns then he'll turn out to be a complete back to a devotee but surprisingly he's a devotee of Shiva of the Divine Mother of Krishna of Ganga he's indeed intensely devotional but then if you take the brushes the commentaries on the Upanishads and the bhagavad-gita and the Brahma sutras then it falls into place basically devotion is helpful what he will basically say there is if you ask then why haven't you talked about knowledge in that him worship Krishna by the grace of Krishna you will get knowledge and get freedom I'm not putting it this way if you see the commentaries again and again when the Gita it'll come whenever devotion is prescribed Shankar Acharya will chime in yes this is great because it leads to knowledge and so then after knowledge you get enlightenment so like that that's a very beautiful hymn very popular Raja Govinda Govinda Govinda Majnu Rome at the OU fool worship take the name of God he saw this person memorizing Sanskrit grammar sutras grammar is in the form of sutras there are 4,000 plus sutras of panini now one sutra is this personal sitting and by the bank of the river and memorizing if to memorize a lot she was memorizing the sutra goes like this Duke reincarnated oak reincarnated oak Rincon easy to memorize and Shankar Acharya felt sad for this person that few days later he'll die and all he's done his lifetime is grammar and then he sank his thing's dynamo Piaget nice I am proud she Shira Vasant open era I oughta Kollek rarity gotcha TI Utada Pina munchetty Asha Abajo paja govindam Raja Govinda Govinda Majnu gravity properties and nahin khaali nahi nahi rukhsati to Kareem Kareem II he thinks that he's seeing that person memorized Sanskrit grammar rules sutras nowadays would call them algorithms there like that and he says evening has come again it will become morning if day turns into evening spring autumn into winter winter into spring and so on the seasons come and go time is dancing caller Creed at the time plays on gotcha ti you your life is running out never to come back again your days are running out then he says but the the flame of this desire asha here means desire not hope in the positive sense that just this little more and then everything will be good i'll make one more killing on the stock exchange and then i'll be set for life this gadget iphone 8 it that that's that that's it and then I'll be really happy and that thing and that's it and be really happy this relationship that vacation I'll be really happy and so on no none of it is the end nothing nothing in this way nothing can be nothing will come to a conclusion it will just go on and on and on never never will you get fulfilment then he says worship the Lord worship the Lord worship the Lord you fool when the time comes properties and nahin khaali when the time that time comes means the time of when the time of death draws near nahi nahi rukhsati doctrine Carini your sanskrit grammar will not help you only the Lord can help you it's a beautiful hymn it goes on and on and on very touching very touching so he evokes devotion for God but here the materialist view is put forward that's one point of view another point of view it's not the materialist view it's it could be the Buddhist view the Buddhist view is the Atman the self is not a permanent entity like the Hindus say it is it is born and destroyed every moment there is a self but it is a continuous stream William James coined the term stream of consciousness the Buddhist view is something like that we are a continuous stream born and dying every moment to moment to moment to moment could be that view also I think it's basically what Vedic Hindus believed at that time not a materialist view not the Buddhist view but the view that we are subtle bodies we are born with the birth of this body this body dies when we go on with propelled by our past karma to other worlds and other lives and we are born Vita and be upon and we try that view is talking about and why do I think that we'll see the next few verses they support this conclusion another question here this is that even if you think you are born with the birth of the body and you die with the death of the body and you don't agree to the vedantic view or the Advaitic view of the Ottoman even then you should not grieve why not a powerful verse 27 this verse is not philosophy it's common sense Java's he drew home with you - he drew home with you Dhruva Maharaja Dhruva Maharaja the smart opera Xavier the smart very hard year t-not emoji tomorrow huh see not on show chittim rehearsing very poetic - one who is born death is certain crisp Sanskrit phrase ja das sir he drew over to death is certain - one who is born drew Anjana mamita sketcher and this is more problematic birth again is certain for the one who has died he'll go on to other lives he or she therefore what's the upshot of all of this opera Xavier T the inevitable the unchangeable where we have no choice at all what's the point of be veiling the inevitable says that which is a fundamental fact which cannot be changed at all ja das Shahid rumoured to for those were born death is certain Swami Vivekananda puts it very powerfully Saints die and sinners die toppers die an emperors that the learner died and equally do the ignorant die all will time this is certain it has nothing to do with belief non-belief spirituality science medicine nothing one will ultimately die even Avatara but there's Buddha or Jesus or Krishna or Rama or Rama Krishna that physical body has gone when Swami was joking she said we use better words when it comes to spiritual personalities he has ascended to his divine heavenly abode or divine abode okay he may have ascended but basically it means that is the body died the person is dead in India we say four monks when the monks part a pastor he didn't say he died he attain Samadhi maha Samadhi but basically the meaning is that the double body is dead the body's gone the person is dead jiya Tissier he drove Oh to a simple fact worth meditating upon swami vivekananda taught this to a disciple and acceptance of death contemplation of death the disciple said it'll lead to lead to terror and depression and swami vivekananda thoughtfully said that beginning in the beginning it might but afterwards cur will come a great freedom and strength jota's sure he drove over it - there is no choice here and you need not be afraid shri krishna says if you accept the advaithic point of view you need not be afraid at all it is nothing - you really just like changing a suit of clothes he said that like changing clothes old clothes if you do not accept the operating point of view even then it's nothing to you because it's inevitable and he says you are not destroyed the next part is druvan gentleman Rita's future birth will be is certain for those who have died now this phrase inclusion of this phrase shows that it's not the materialistic point of view if it was the materialistic point of view you're dead finished no religion is possible nothing more matters after that but the moment Krishna says drew on Genma metres future after death again birth is certain propelled by our past karma so with this phrase he has introduced the entire karma and rebirth idea which is so common in India I say India not Vedanta not Hinduism when we learnt the great ways and the teacher said these two things karma and rebirth the doctrine of karma and the doctrine of rebirth in Hindi karma or punar janma karma vodka general doctrine of rebirth these two are truly profound doctrines teachings why he says we disagree on almost everything else whether God exists or not but this don't talk about God Giants don't talk about God there are schools of Hinduism which do not talk about God whether God is with form or without form whether God exists or not then what is the a to enlightenment which is it bhakti devotion is it knowledge gana is it meditation is it austerity what is it many many views not only that do you exist on that also there is dispute the Buddhist says there's no permanent self it's a stream of changes flux Shani come Shani come serve imanakum momentary momentary all his momentary soon iam soon iam sarvam shown iam mt mt all his empty and the hindu says there is an eternal self all these differences are admitted wide variety of views viewpoints in Indian philosophy yet this Vedanta teacher was saying yet these two karma and rebirth are common across the board Jani Jains Buddhists Sikhs Hindus and all the varieties of Hindus Vaishnavas Shiva's charcters non duelists duelists qualified monists a difference identity in difference I didn't have a debate so many schools tantrics everybody except the materialist accepts that there is karma and there is rebirth it was a non duelist he says take it seriously you come here what yes no it's only for the rest of us so for the for what krishna remember up to now krishna was teaching the highest advaitha pure consciousness Atman it's not born there's no question of rebirth let me tell you this funny story I told you earlier one of our monks he was in the Himalayas in a little cottage he was studying the Hindu or Indian idea of rebirth many lifes punar janma and the Abrahamic idea there's only one life Jews Christians Muslims they say there's only one life you didn't exist earlier you are created by the creator and life is there after that you wait in in stasis or something for a long time until you get your heavenly life order or the hellish fire whatever now there's only one life you don't get many bodies many many lives so which is true both can't be true they're actually both are true you know how the way I understand it is if you take the broader if you take the holistic worldview there are many births and deaths if you take one birth and death that's one life if you don't know what came before that if you don't know what comes after that you will just say there was only one life and this is what this is a conscious choice the conscious choice if you actually go to the Bible and Old Testament there are any number of references to past lives I was such now I am this so there are many such references there was a committee in the during the Roman Empire and they studied this matter many lives or one life and the resolution was that lets lets rule out many lives and we will decide the committee decided this is going to be one of one life from now on because it was not advantageous to a particular Roman Emperor I think something like that some some kind of choice was made so in the ancient history of all religions many lives are admitted anyhow the point is one life or many life so this monk he was studying both sides and this way and that way and all the other monks in that cottage they were annoyed with him they got bored of listening to these arguments so he took his argument outside and then another ashram nearby there was a great non dualist master I was a monk who was an extreme god about the type of non dualist ayaat Awad what we are studying in mondo Rica so he goes there Swami these are the arguments in favor of many lives poon agenda reincarnation these are the arguments in favor of one life that there's only a cogent Bovada one life then that Swami said and that teacher he said o Swami why are you talking about all of this when there is no but where is the question rebirth read man do cure because they're hunting to man Duke you are not even born once let alone many lives Atman is not even born once the whole thing is Maya is an appearance in Hindi he said array Mahatma ji job John Mohini to punar janma Kaka up man do Kapadia and that Swami came back and told me our Swami said he was furious you can't argue with these non-dualistic I but I see I've got a serious question to ask and he will simply go to Maya and Brahman and the whole question is dismissed yes but then you said didn't you say everybody accepts karma and rebirth so non duellist also accept you said yes but remember non-dualism varaha rica para martica transactional level empirical level relative level this world everything is accepted param arctic and the absolute sense only brahman yeah there was a time when Shankara was teaching and and the other schools of Hinduism this Brahman alone is real world is an appearance I am Brahman these fellows are atheists some said these fellows are Buddhists and it's not the dualist hindus attacked a non-dual is saying that pretend about Dada these people are crypto Buddhists even now Shankar has called cryptic with this person because there they seem to deny conventional religion they ask the Duellists do believe the Ganges is a holy river do you go to temples and bow down before God do you perform the ceremonies for departed ancestors Rudra because you are seeing the world is false you're saying the world is false so are you denying religion you guys are atheists so we had to explain that if Shankara and his disciples had to explain that listen we accept everything there are two levels of reality one is the ultimate reality which is Brahman where the question of their it's not that you do not accept religion and you're an atheist neither these nor it is nothing matters there here in this world we are as much of these as you are we are very happy to go to go on pilgrimages and take a dip in the holy Ganges and any religious activity is very good because we regard it as a very good preparation for the ultimate knowledge at a transactional level we call it via Baja Rica relative level aren't you studying Vedanta where are you studying Vedanta is Brahman studying the Adhan Thor you coming to class and attending classes if that is real then why can't you go to a temple and bow down or a church and sing hymns why can't you do social service and give both arms to the purpose everything is accepted at this level but ultimately from Brahman point of view everything is in appearance and you are you are that ultimate reality so this is this was Shankar's point of view yeah okay quickly some people look at it that way does knowledge start with Vashisht Advaita why only we should track the way to do it a let us say we go from a dualistic point of view to a qualified monastic to a non-dualistic point of view I have no objection in swami vivekananda in self has spoken that we are latter theory but the problem is will the dualist and the qualified monist accept it that you are the middle rung in the ladder of the lowest rung is a ladder I don't think so for a non-dual it's no problem Nandu list as long as dawn dualism is the highest rung we have we are we are fine with it you are fine with it and the non-dualistic but it's a little demeaning for sure for the dualist duellist can the dualist do this usually they cannot because the non-dualistic an give a relative reality to dualism but the dwellest cannot speak in terms of relative reality and absolute reality for the dualist there is only one reality this is it this is it then where is God somewhere there's also a place called heaven there is God in heaven and all of this is this one reality but what the dwelling does is this is an appearance and right here is the absolute reality Brahman which trying to show you so the non duelist can make space for dualism dualism cannot easily make space for non-dualism that's why you'll find the dualist schools usually they are furious with non duelists and there are dual schools who say that you know they will say about other religions in in Hinduism they're a little narrow kind of dual SUSE about other religions even they can be rescued but these non dual is start the worst they can never be rescued they're finished let me go ahead so the whole idea of karma and reincarnation sin is introduced here in this little narrow a little phrase through one gentleman Rita sketcher the certain is birth for those who die when we die propelled by our past karma what dies physical body we've discussed this earlier three bodies physical body subtle body causal body beyond that the Atman now when the when death comes death comes for the physical body the subtle body and the causal body they said it sort of curls up into a seed like form and he goes of it and it is reborn again when it gets another suitable physical body how do you how does it get a physical body based on its past Karma we all have enormous stores of past karma a part of that gives us a particular physical body that part of my karma which has given me this physical body is called prarabdha Karma literally if you translate well begun it has started to give results and so whatever I experienced in this life all the major events of my life are because of that past Karma I have a degree of freedom but my parents my health my lifespan so the lifespan of this physical body depends on that slice of my past karma which has generated this physical body once that is exhausted this body will time and the next another slice of my karma will become active and generate a new body for me next life what will happen the subtle body and the causal body will inhabit that and then slowly develop into maturity as that physical body it blooms into maturity then it'll start working again not very different from when you take you know earlier in a computer would crash these to have the programs in floppy disk so we would take the floppy disk and put it into the new computer and would start working again now in the disk itself floppy disk itself it's not usable it's not usable it's there everything is there but not usable but once you put it you need a new computer when you put it in there then you can see everything again similarly our subtle body tendencies I am our carbon our our vasanas desires all are there but not functioning they can't function without a physical body when you are put into a new physical body as the body develops that subtle body also develops along with it and then you get a new life this is what he means Drouin Jan Mamata sketcher certain is birth for the dead but for whom only for the unenlightened that we have many lives is not good news for the Hindu it's bad news it's a thing to be said to be gotten out of there was a joke a cartoon when this Christian born-again Christian guy is saying to the Hindu look I'm a born-again Christian and the Hindu is saying oh I'm a born again and again and again and again in a very cute cartoon it is - because why is it bad ultimately it's not bad in itself it keeps on giving us a stream of experiences ultimately it is bad because it is under limitation we do not know who we truly are and it's subject to endless suffering endless suffering yes yeah yes absolutely not only that not only at the end of the day you are that absolute truth right now that that is most empowering even if I do not realize it I am perfectly safe right now you are perfectly safe right now everything is alright from that point of view yes but remember one thing krishna is switching his standpoint here he notices that you say you are finding Advait empowering arjuna was not finding it empowering krishna notice is that so he is switching to a more common-sense approach something that arjuna being a hindu of those times would be more accustomed to thinking you think that you were born with this body you existed in other bodies earlier and you will exist later on that's what you think he says yes that's what he have been taught even then you should not grieve for about death of this this body that's what Krishna is trying to say already he said even if but if he has used those words and that means all that I have taught till now advaita if it's not sinking in if it seems fantastic impossible in that case let me give you some common sense advice that also it will work that you should not feel disturbed by death yes all right go on and one can say more about that yeah yeah correct ultimately many great philosophers have said that the purpose of all of this is enlightenment freedom perfection as different as Shankara and Hegel and others that said the ultimate it's moving towards call it a spiritual realization call it a perfection call it an Enlightenment so that's what we are doing reading the pages of life in a book each page is one life turnover page one left corner and the soul is soul means the subtle body is evolving learning growing it's one way of looking at it and what will be the purpose of all of this attainment of our real nature which is infinity from the limited to the infinite that's where we are going the beautiful prayer from the unreal to the real from darkness and to light from death what is death not one death many deaths in one way it's more terrifying many deaths to immortality beyond death this thing about being reborn krishna puts it nicely for the dead rebirth is certain Upanishads give a very shocking language brick to summit to map note here here narnia pashyati who sees plurality here difference here dualism here that one what is the result that one goes from death to death could have been nicer you know could have said goes from birth to birth didn't know that one goes from death to death to shock the shock value yes okay the lady first and end that is true you are saying that how is the informations transferred if there's nothing obvious going from one body to another in the material world that's true if we could find that then religion would have a scientific basis there that's why I said what krishna is saying here is not the materialist point of view is the conventional religious point of view of ancient hindus bodies died but you go on what goes on if you ask what is the basis for transformation of all the transfer of all this information sukshma sharir if as what is sukshma sharir they will say it is made of sukshma tan Matra according to the ancient cosmology these physical bodies are made of five elements this is kind of thinking which many ancient civilizations had space fire air fire water earth so this is a combination of these elements has made this body but what ancient Indian cosmology goes a step further or deeper it says our subtle bodies are also made of these elements these elements have a gross aspect physical aspect which is this so this is Earth in that they'll be liquid that is water in there is heat it's hot so that is here fire and so on but there are subtle aspects of this the five elements come in sukshma and stool so the the subtle aspects are called Sushma tan Matra yogis are supposed to be able to see that the subtle and we also see it in a certain way how think of thought feel an emotion experience a desire love hate all those things which you are experiencing right now those are the subtle elements what is happening in the physical body neurons are firing in the brain which is gross element according to Vedanta terms or some key terms but what you are experiencing that is the proof of the existence of subtle elements you know I will immediately talk about the hard problem of consciousness here but yes for the first time modern science we have narrowed down the problem until you can explain a simple thing like you think of a rose think of the beautiful flower right now experience the redness the shape of the flower explain it in terms of neuronal activity of the brain the experience you are having you cannot its come to a dead end literally and I'm seeing now time and time again symposiums conferences consciousness consciousness kind of what is consciousness again there's a we have an informal sort of philosophy Cafe which I want wandered into sometimes and we discuss it the next topic is again is consciousness fundamental it's happening across the top philosophies neuroscience departments it trying to neuroscience departments are trying to reduce consciousness to the brain then your question will be valid there is nothing which is transmitted after death how will the subtle body go where is the subtle body then there's no subtle body the charvaka will be right but they are unable to reduce the conscious to consciousness or mind to the physical brain then what is consciousness or mind you can't deny it exists because you are experiencing it I am experiencing it everybody is experiencing it in fact that's all that we experience the very word experience means consciousness is there and some kind of subtle body is there otherwise no experience is possible so there is a subtle body to answer your question sukshma sharir which goes from physical body to dead physical body to a new living physical body a baby maybe and then based reborn in that body it's a proof that it exists I can give you first-person proof that you you are experiencing it yourself but show me that it believes something leaves this physical body and goes it must be a kind of metal which we have not discovered I don't know that is the question mark if if you ever discover that you know a little bit have a tremendous impact it will prove that religion is real that something goes on after death will prove that religion is real all right let's you had a question at the end yeah let's see at them because we are run out of time yes but not of the body after enlightenment a body then at no point is the body reborn right the subtle body is reborn in a new physical body what happens in death yeah so to answer that question it's open it should say that at the point of enlightenment the enlightened person continues as long as the Karma for that particular body lasts that is called jeevan mukthi when that the karma for that body is exhausted that body falls apart just like for every one of us but is it difference the difference is for the subtle body also dissolves away for that person for us the subtle body continues why would that happen remember what is the purpose of the whole thing purpose is enlightenment so in one sense the purpose of nature is served and this idea actually has come from a more ancient teaching of Sankhya Prakriti purusa prakruti means nature nature does everything for the experience and enlightenment experience and release Bagh apavarga of the purusa that idea is incorporated into advaitha the subtle body dissolves after enlightenment Upanishads are therefore say this going back to your first question question is is and solution in search of a problem that many lives will be will be free from the cycle of birth and death I don't even know about the cycle of birth and death I'll be free from a problem which I don't know about actually if you investigate the human condition you will come across this birth and death problem as it is something pervasive in in the Indian thought but that's not the only way that evidence that can be framed suppose people asked suppose in a in a society which does not believe in believe in past lives and future lives just this life does Vedanta have any use tremendous use Vedanta says you can make it neutral from that perspective you can directly say what is the purpose of Vedanta authentic a deliberately paramon and the practice Chur complete cessation of sorrow here and now this life sorrow an attainment of deep lasting peace and bliss this life forget past life forget future life it need not talk about it that was because of the cultural context of India in those days that was the solution to this whole cycle of birth and death and as that master said take it seriously as you start thinking about life in itself if you take time to be real action to be real cause and effect to be real once you take that and we do take these things to be real immediately the consequence implication will be we there and we will be if we wear and if we will be then in that case karma and birth and death are there so it's so it's a very deep kind of conclusion yes not directly obvious if it was directly obviously the materialist would accept it and if the hard problem of consciousness is solved in that way that they find something which survives and encodes personal information after death then you have it if not you need not talk in those terms talk just in terms of this life answer to suffering all right Oh Shante Shante t hurry he owned that sat sri ramakrishna Aparna Musto [Music]